When did The FA allow Sunday matches ?

Part-Timer

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I recall that cricket used the entry by programme workaround for Sunday League matches. If I remember correctly this basically meant that buying a scorecard was compulsory instead of voluntary.
 

Hoddy1.

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Perhaps Bradford's game kicked off earlier...
Bolton was 14-00. Think I got a single sheet programme.

Bradford City 4 Alvechurch 2 in Jan 1974 at Valley Parade. The programme cover for the FA Cup 3rd Round.


So perhaps that quote should be one of the first ?
 

Northstandexile

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No floodlights allowed so all matches would be early kick offs.

i remembered going to an a midweek FACup replay at Old Show Ground, Scunthorpe with a 1.45 pm kick off in case of extra time.
 

Lily White

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Yes, an experiment to see if attendances would improve on a Sunday, but probably the gate was boosted by the novelty value, and by many neutrals.WisbechDunstable.jpg
 

Hoddy1.

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No floodlights allowed so all matches would be early kick offs.

i remembered going to an a midweek FACup replay at Old Show Ground, Scunthorpe with a 1.45 pm kick off in case of extra time.
Yes early kick offs but floodlights would have been allowed if team wanted to use them and had had a generator and the opposition had no objection.
Many games soon after this day had evening games.

Took teams a short while to get the generators in , my first game with generators was Wed Jan 16 , Man City v Coventry in the LC R5 Rep @ 19-30.

A double was Wed Jan 30 , Bolton v Southampton @ 14-00 in the FA Cup (Replay) followed by Man City v Plymouth @ 19-30 in the L C SF 2nd leg.
 
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John Treleven

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Something I wrote on the previous site ten years ago re the background to the introduction of the F.A, Sunday Cup in 1964 which then opened the way for other competitions to play on a Sunday -

Sunday leisure and entertainment activities had long been constrained by successive Sunday Observance Acts which also prohibited the charging for admission to such events. One consequence of this was the introduction of "admission by programme" in order to circumvent the law. So if finding a programme for a Sunday fixture with a cover price considerably higher than expected for its time then this is the reason. It was also deemed in the religious areas of society unacceptable to partake in such activities on a Sunday, which was deemed a "day of rest". However amongst those that worked on Saturdays and supported their local teams later in the day Sundays became their day to play the game.

The Football Association long upheld the traditional view and did not officially recognise Sunday football, other than to place restrictions on it. Those that played or officiated in Sunday football were not allowed to participate in matches on other days of the week. Therefore many players and officials used false names when participating on a Sunday.

The F.A. gradually came around to reviewing the problems that this was causing , notably in the big cities where organised Sunday football was prevalent. In August 1939 it was proposed that they appoint a Sub-Committee to review the situation but war intervened and it was not until 24th September 1943 that the Committee members were actually appointed. One of these was Edward "Teddy" Eden, the F.A. Councillor for Birmingham, who was to spend the next 17 years persuading other F.A. Councillors to recognise Sunday football.

The majority opinion of the reviewing Committee was to ease the restrictions and allow Sunday play under certain conditions. These recommendations were put forward in October 1945 but those who opposed Sunday football had not been idle and had gathered sufficient support to have the initial proposals watered down and to be re-considered at the end of the season.

When re-considered in July 1946 these opponents won the day and so no changes were made, but resolutions continued to be made to the F.A. Council, without success, every year. The Council again shelved a decision in 1952 but Sunday football continued to grow and eventually in 1960 all restrictions were lifted. However the delay in reaching this decision had caused much bitterness
amongst the players and officials of Sunday football.

The F.A. therefore needed to adopt, through its County Associations, a policy of slow assimilation, with the intent that the Sunday Leagues and Clubs would see the benefit of joining the F.A. fold, but there were still hard cores of resistance. Nevertheless the lifting of restrictions led to the spread of Sunday football to counties where it was previously unknown.

In 1964, with Teddy Eden now Chairman of the Committee responsible, the F.A. introduced a national competition to further encourage the spread of Sunday football. Due to the varying conditions under which it was played in different parts of the country the initial rules were based upon those of the F.A. County Youth Cup established 20 years before. County F.A.'s could enter a
representative side drawn from their various clubs or nominate one of their clubs to represent them.

Sixteen counties entered with only London using a nominated club - Summerstown Athletic, near Wimbledon, and it was they that went on to win the inaugural competition. Teddy Eden, having seen the competition get successfully underway, died midway through the following season on 26th January 1966, aged 86, only two days after presiding at what was to be his final Sunday Football committee meeting.
 
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DonQuixote

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Nice piece John....

ah the Sunday Observance Act.

From memory, you could buy a copy of Parade or Tit Bits on a Sunday - other publications available in the early 60s were Spic and Span - but it was illegal to purchase a copy of the Bible on said day.
 
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Tykeoldboy

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Nice piece John....

ah the Sunday Observance Act.

From memory, you could buy a copy of Parade or Tit Bits on a Sunday - other publications available in the early 60s were Spic and Span - but it was illegal to purchase a copy of the Bible on said day.
Sunday trading was a joke. You could buy food from a Chinese takeaway, even English dishes, but you couldn't buy fish & chips from the chippy
 

AV1960

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This is certainly bringing back a few memories.
My first Sunday football was also on 20/1/74 when I saw Walsall beat Wrexham 3-0 in the Football League Div Three. Admission was by team sheet, which you bought from the turnstiles for 45p. If I remember correctly, I had been up since the early hours queuing around The Odeon in Birmingham to buy tickets to see The Carpenters in concert. I wonder how much abuse would be generated by a write up of their gig on Retro WDYG???
The following Sunday there was more football at Highfield Road for Coventry City 0 Derby County 0 in the F.A.Cup Round Four.
My strangest game during the period of the floodlight ban was Birmingham City 1 Plymouth 2 in the League Cup Round Four on the afternoon of Wednesday 19/12/73. At the time I worked within walking distance of St.Andrews so I started the day at work, saw the game and then returned to work.
When cricket first dipped it's feet in the Sunday waters, I attended Warwickshire v International Cavaliers at Edgbaston on Sunday 16th June, 1968. I think admission was restricted to Warwickshire members but you could buy membership for the day at the turnstiles. Simples! Warwickshire's full first XI won a 40 over game by five wickets with Amiss 102 not out. Many famous names in the visiting side including R.B.Simpson, C.Lloyd, D.Kenyon, T.Bailey and F.S.Trueman.
 

DonQuixote

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My only Sunday game of that season came on 3.3.74 - Chelmsford v Romford SLP.

This was played 24 hours after our FA Trophy replay at Stafford.

The three-day week worked out well for me as I was working for a big city printers near
Old Street, North London at the time.

We had our own generator so were allowed to work five days, which we did but was still
cut at noon every day and got paid for the full week...which was nice.

Some of us took in a couple of Millwall League cup matches - Luton and Norwich - which
were both played on a midweek afternoon, in front of a full house at Cold Blow Lane.

When there was no football , it was off to the Ship and Turtle in Leadenhall Street until
it shut at 3pm, then onto the Circle Line for a kip until five, when they opened again!
 

John Treleven

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I remember Q.P.R. v Plymouth Argyle in F.L. Cup 4 - 0-3 20th November 1973 - a generator in use
and Plymouth Argyle v Manchester City in FLC SF1 - 1-1 23rd January 1974 - a midweek afternoon

The latter is the last time I saw pirate programmes on sale, a common feature of big matches post war
 

Hoddy1.

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Plymouth Argyle v Manchester City in FLC SF1 - 1-1 23rd January 1974 - a midweek afternoon
With the 2nd leg a week later on the Wednesday at 19-30.
 
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BillShep

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Sunday 11th January 1987 - KO 15:05

Luton Town v Liverpool FA Cup 3rd Round

At this time Luton had the away football supporters ban on. A few hundred Liverpool fans had travelled anyway as there are means and ways of getting into a football ground.
A few lads had a walk up to the ground and found it quite easy to just walk into it through open double gates alongside the people who were setting up the advertising hoardings. Luckily this was a Liverpool company so it wasn't really that odd for Scouse accents to be heard.
A lot of us went to Celtic Supporters Club and quite a few of the lads there were members of the Luton Town Fan Card Scheme. This allowed them to get tickets for 2 guests. About 15 Celtic lads had were in this scheme and when we were able to obtain tickets they started to contact other locals to come and get some more tickets.
Luton at the time had a high profile Tory MP on their board and he was fuming when he realised we were able to buy tickets and gain access to the ground.
 

MiddxSaint

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Couldn't Everton not play on Sundays due to a nearby church?
 

Canary

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Lord (Ted) Willis's Sunday Entertainments Bill in 1967 meant that soccer would be allowed to be played on a Sunday. Consequently, in May 1967 the FA of Wales changed its rule to allow soccer to be played on Sunday.
 

Bigaitch

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Sunday 11th January 1987 - KO 15:05

Luton Town v Liverpool FA Cup 3rd Round

At this time Luton had the away football supporters ban on. A few hundred Liverpool fans had travelled anyway as there are means and ways of getting into a football ground.
A few lads had a walk up to the ground and found it quite easy to just walk into it through open double gates alongside the people who were setting up the advertising hoardings. Luckily this was a Liverpool company so it wasn't really that odd for Scouse accents to be heard.
A lot of us went to Celtic Supporters Club and quite a few of the lads there were members of the Luton Town Fan Card Scheme. This allowed them to get tickets for 2 guests. About 15 Celtic lads had were in this scheme and when we were able to obtain tickets they started to contact other locals to come and get some more tickets.
Luton at the time had a high profile Tory MP on their board and he was fuming when he realised we were able to buy tickets and gain access to the ground.
David Evans was the MP concerned and was the Luton chairman. With a ban on away fans and a plastic pitch they had such a ridiculous advantage, that he refused to acknowledge.

Colchester United had a similar scheme running and about 300 Orient fans joined up to get tickets to the game at Layer Road. Col U completely ignored the fact that addresses for memberships were suddenly turning up from all over East London and happily sent memberships and tickets out. Fortunately the game passed off without incident although the faces of some of the home fans were a picture when Os fans started chanting.
 

BertD

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& Related Leagues.
Sixteen counties entered with only London using a nominated club - Summerstown Athletic, near Wimbledon, and it was they that went on to win the inaugural competition.
Summerstown Athletic, representing the London F.A., was not only near Wimbledon, but fielded four ex-Dons in the side. Attached is a rather leaning article I wrote some time ago for our history magazine.

Incidentally Wimbledon's first Sunday match was 13/10/73 at home to Grantham in the Southern League.
Cray Wanderers played two Metropolitan League matches near the end of the 1967/68 season.
 

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John Treleven

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WHEN (SORT OF) WIMBLEDON WON THE F.A. SUNDAY CUP

Everyone knows that Wimbledon are the only team to win the F.A. Amateur Cup and the F.A. Cup, but not many will be aware of their part in winning the first ever F.A. Sunday Cup in 1964/65.

Before 1960 the F.A. effectively barred players or clubs under their authority from playing competitive football on Sunday, although many lower League professionals and top amateur players were reputed to be playing regularly under assumed names. In 1960 they relented to pressure and sanctioned amateur Sunday football. It was but a short hop from there to the first national F.A. Sunday Cup in 1964/65.

By the following season it had become a club competition, but in that fledgling first season entries were invited from County Association representative sides. Sixteen counties took up the baton and, after an early season knockout competition, Summerstown Athletic won the right to represent the London F.A. Included in the Summerstown team were several players that had regularly pulled on the blue and white of Wimbledon on Saturdays.

Southern Section - Quarter-Finals Lincolnshire 3-8 Norfolk Bedfordshire 1-4 Hertfordshire London 2-1 Surrey Sussex 6-5 Wiltshire
Northern Section - Quarter-Finals Birmingham 4-5 Northamptonshire Staffordshire 8-1 Worcestershire Cumberland 1-0 Yorkshire West Riding Liverpool 6-3 Manchester

Summerstown Athletic 2-1 Surrey County F.A.

Athletic beat Surrey in the first game, played at Hounslow in December. Although no match report has been found so far it’s known the team comprised: Ives, McGuinness, Philpott, Kent, Shears, Hawkins, Kenchington (T), Mills, Kenchington (P), Griffiths, Hickey.

John Shears, Peter Kenchington and Keith Mills were Wimbledon players, and another Don, Paddy Long, would have played but for suspension.

Southern Section - Semi-Finals Norfolk 2-3 Hertfordshire London 3-1 Sussex
Northern Section - Semi-Finals Northamptonshire 1-4 Staffordshire Cumberland 3-2 Liverpool 2

Summerstown Athletic 3-1 Sussex County F.A.

Summerstown, representing the London FA in the quarter-finals of the FA Amateur Sunday Cup, took the lead following a free-kick in the 12th minute. Peter Kenchington took the ball towards a wall of defenders and then neatly lobbed it over their heads and into the Sussex net. Sussex came close with a shot that smashed against a post and shortly afterwards George Ives had to go full length. But Summerstown were getting on top now and Griffiths notched their second before the interval. Harding scored the third from the penalty spot in the second half after Keith Mills, with only the goalkeeper to beat, had been brought down from behind. The Sussex goal came from Bill Ford.

South London Press, 5th February 1965

Southern Section – Final Hertfordshire 0-3 London
Northern Section – Final Staffordshire 6-1 Cumberland

Hertfordshire County F.A. 0-3 Summerstown Athletic

Summerstown, representing the london FA, in a bid to capture Sunday football's top prize,
the FA Amateur Sunday Cup, were right back on top of their form. After only seven minutes Keith Mills cottoned on to a long through ball by Peter Kenchington to score the first goal. Paddy Long would have added another but for a handling offence, but no harm was done for Harding crashed home the spot kick rightly awarded. Athletic had to put up with some heavy pressure after the interval, but co-operative defensive work kept their goal intact, and then Kenchington smashed home a third from 15 yards to put the issue beyond doubt.

South London Press, Friday 19th March 1965

FINAL – 1ST LEG

Staffordshire County F.A. 1-1 Summerstown Athletic

Goalkeeper Ives saved the day for Summerstown, representing the London FA in this Amateur Sunday Cup final, first leg, at Walsall, when he tipped over Glover's penalty a few minutes before the end. Staffordshire had taken the lead in the first half when Harper beat Ives with a curling drive from twenty yards following a pin-point centre. Athletic's chances receded still further after the interval when defender Tony McGuinness became a wing passenger through injury. But a brilliant move by Dave Hawkins gave robust Peter Kenchington his chance to crack an unstoppable equaliser.

South London Press, Friday 9th April 1965

FINAL – 2ND LEG

Summerstown Athletic 5-1 Staffordshire County F.A.

Summerstown, representing the London FA, saved their goal talents until extra-time in the second leg of the FA Amateur Sunday Cup Final at Hounslow on Sunday. When the whistle went at the end of ninety minutes the two teams were on level terms at 1-1. Long scored the first of four extra time goals when he sliced the ball over the goalkeeper's head after collecting a pass from Keith Mills. Seconds later the Mills-Long duet found the net again. Peter Kenchington, who had a shaky game, sent Summerstown into a 4-1 lead when he latched onto another Mills pass. It was tit-for-tat shortly afterwards when Mills flicked the fifth after receiving a pass from Kenchington. Pat Long scored the first goal in the fifth minute, but Staffordshire soon drew level when Glover cottoned on to a Ron Philpott pass-back meant for goalkeeper George Ives.

South London Press, Friday 14th May 1965

Former Dons scored all Athletic’s goals in the two legs of the first ever FA Sunday Cup Final.
Peter Kenchington John Shears Keith Mills Paddy Long
 

John Treleven

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F.A. Sunday Cup

1964-65

The Iranian Ambassador, on behalf of the Shahanshah of Iran (Shah of Persia), presented a trophy to the Football Association on 15th June 1964 to celebrate the centenary of the F.A. in 1963. At the subsequent reception it was announced that it would be allocated to the new F.A. Sunday Cup.

For the first season it was held on a County basis with Counties able to enter a club, league or representative side. 16 counties entered and the final would be held over two legs.

The first round (regional quarter-finals) had to be completed by Sunday 27th December.

The first match was at Carlisle on Saturday 31st October 1964 and was watched by over 1,000. The round was completed on Sunday 20th December when London met Surrey.

Cumberland again attracted over 1,000 for their second match but most attendances were 200-300 with one unnamed "Midlands" match attracting just 7.

The first leg of the final attracted just under 1,500 spectators, including many from London. The competition was won by London, represented by Summerstown Athletic, near Wimbledon, whereas their Staffordshire opponents, in the first leg at least, included players from six different clubs.

The competition was opened up to clubs for the following season and the F.A. reported that over
1,600 requests for entry forms had been made.

Southern Section
Quarter-Finals
Lincolnshire 3, Norfolk 8 (after extra time)
Bedfordshire 1, Hertfordshire 4
London 2, Surrey 1
Sussex 6, Wiltshire 5
Semi-Finals
Norfolk 2, Hertfordshire 3
London 3, Sussex 1
Final
Hertfordshire 0, London 3

Northern Section
Quarter-Finals

Birmingham 4, Northamptonshire 5
Staffordshire 8, Worcestershire 1
Cumberland 1, Yorkshire West Riding 0
Liverpool 6, Manchester 3
Semi-Finals
Northamptonshire 1, Staffordshire 4
Cumberland 3, Liverpool 2
Final
Staffordshire 6, Cumberland 1

Overall Final
1st Leg, Sunday 4th April at Blakenhall F.C., Leamore, near Walsall
(note not at Fellows Park, Walsall as commonly mis-reported)
Staffordshire (Harper 35) 1, London (Kenchington 43) 1
Ives (London GK) saved Glover penalty 89 minutes
2nd Leg, Sunday 9th May at Hounslow F.C., Denbigh Road
London (Long 3, 92 & 93, Kenchington 110, Mills 115) 5, Staffordshire (Glover 15) 1
after extra time, 1-1 at 90 minutes

Players mentioned in one or other of the two matches -
London - Hawkins (captain), Clayton, Harding, Ives, Kenchington, Long, Mills, Shears
Staffordshire - Robbins (captain), Austin, Bailey, Glover, Harper, Mason, Shinton, Taylor

Trophy presented to the winners by the Iranian Ambassador.
 

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