Step 6 promotion applicants from step 7

Pawn Of Prophecy

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@Pawn Of Prophecy - I do not think that is right. The leagues currently below the Surrey Elite cannot declare themselves as feeder leagues, that is up to the Surrey County FA. Even then the FA has to approve it

As for the Doncaster and Sheffield news, I do not know enough about past movement in the area to know if the assertion that the top Division of the Doncaster League is below all three divisions of the Sheffield League is correct. When clubs move between the leagues, how are they really compared?
Apologies if incorrect. I took my information from Non League Matters results and tables pages, which states that both the "Step 8" Surrey leagues promote into the Surrey Elite.

There has been promotion and relegation between the two in recent times. West End Village went up and then went back down. Chessington KC came up and have stayed up.
 

Harry West

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In the past there has been talk/efforts to create a Cumbria/Cumberland league at Step 7. If I recall correctly this hasn't worked out due to the travelling issues.

However, maybe, the new powers given to the County FA's could give more flexibility with even additional Step 7 leagues being carved out of some areas.

Perhaps this flexibility could allow the existing Cumberland County league to be at Step 7 for the north of Cumbria and the Westmorland league (with the Furness area clubs) forming a South Lakeland League also at Step 7. The relative standards of these leagues is largely immaterial as their purpose is to act as a stepping stone to any local clubs with ambitions to move towards Step 6.

The next part too is only guesswork:

ln the Sheffield and Hallam FA area there's currently the County League and the Central Midlands Divisions providing Step 7 football. Although the C Mids league has had a good reputation it may be facing radical change.

I am guessing that the Sheffield and Hallam County FA area will be split into two Step 7 leagues with the Doncaster Senior League becoming the second such league. Clubs to be split up on a geographical basis.

I suspect that the C Mids league will lose all of its' clubs which are based in the Sheffield and Hallamshire FA area to these two local Step 7 leagues.

A knock-on effect of the above might be that the Notts, Lincs and Derbs County FA's will be providing Step 7 leagues for the remaining C Mids League clubs. It may be that the C Mids will be reduced in area so that it forms one of these leagues?

Guessing ,again, I can see two Step 7 leagues in Notts (i.e. north and south). Derbs to have its' own Step 7 league.

Further south I can see the Gloucestershire FA area effectively merged with Herefordshire and southern Worcestershire to come up with two Step 7 leagues i.e. north and south.

At the end of the day Step 7 is there to provide a good standard of football for local clubs to aim for without too much travelling. It is also there to provide ambitious clubs with the opportunity to progress up to Step 6. If this means more leagues at Step 7 so be it. Inevitably the standard of such leagues will vary drastically.
 

Gray

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OK…so Shropshire I kinda get. It’s a county, with it own FA, it has clubs and wasn;t previously represented at Step 7 (in its own right).



This whole Doncaster Senior League announcement has thrown me a little.



So the FA are devolving powers below Step 6 back to the regional/county FA. Got it.



But surely their intention/expectation was for the County FA’s to take control and form their own pyramids (which largely exist already due to the Step 7 being in previous existence). So for South Yorkshire, controlled largely by the archaically named Sheffield & Hallam FA, the Sheffield & Hallamshire County League has been the premier competition in the county, with its Top Division holding Step 7 status for a good number of years. Below it was the two other divisions within the same league, and below that was the last remaining district league in the county – the Doncaster Senior League.



So presumably the County FAs are now supposed to put forward a candidate within their area for Regional NLS Feeder Division, which lets face it should be the Sheffield & Hallamshire County League. So what the heck is going on with the Doncaster League and if my assumptions are correct, why have the County FA put forward a second (and I’m guessing much lower quality league) league as a Step 6 feeder division and why have the (national) FA seemingly ratified it?



That’s a jump from Level 14 to Level 11 for the Donny League.



Others have mentioned a free for all below Step 6 now – which I strongly disagree with if that is the case. In counties like Glos (and many other counties too) there is a set pyramid below what was Step 7 and to get to Step 6 you should have to work your way up such a pyramid.



Back to South Yorkshire and the Doncaster League are announcing that South Kirkby Colliery have joined – a club that was seemingly content in the County League and was even included in their proposed constitution several weeks back. The reason they’ve jumped ship….could it be to the Donny League’s three level elevation and an effective promotion/level jump for lower county league sides that decide to switch allegiance? The Donny League seem to be using their new found status as a way to decimate the County League and take back the Eastern half of South Yorkshire.



I mean if you awarded, for example, the Devon & Exeter League and the North Devon League Regional NLS Feeder Division status then whats the incentive to play in the Devon County League – I don’t see one – you can play at the same level in a more regional division with less travelling and still be one application away from Step 6.



I feel this change could (and possibly already is) be abused by certain leagues and county FAs – Step 7 on the whole ran just fine. A power change was probably a good thing and maybe needed – but the structure of that level and the leagues and divisions that it previously encompassed didn’t need to a wholesale change, just some tweaking.



I’m really not sure what the FA are thinking on this one.
I fully agree. Whilst there is a logic to have 2 leagues at the top of some counties like Sussex, North Riding & splitting Berks & Bucks, Devon & Cornwall being already recently split at step7, it does seem strange in a county like Sheffield & Hallamshire. Maybe the idea is to attract clubs from the CML, leaving that league to become basically Derbyshire based.

I think we need to let things develop over the next few years & wouldn't be surprised to see the County FAs in the end creating new "County" leagues on top of the current ones fully run be the county FAs, allowing them to select who they want.

On the other hand if leagues like the Doncaster can sit top of the pile don't see any reason why counties like Herefordshire, Cumberland or even Westmoreland can't have a feeder league status for their county leagues.
 

Unicorn

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@Pawn Of Prophecy - I do not think that is right. The leagues currently below the Surrey Elite cannot declare themselves as feeder leagues, that is up to the Surrey County FA. Even then the FA has to approve it

As for the Doncaster and Sheffield news, I do not know enough about past movement in the area to know if the assertion that the top Division of the Doncaster League is below all three divisions of the Sheffield League is correct. When clubs move between the leagues, how are they really compared?
I think some posters are expecting some sort of wholesale change with lots of new top feeder leagues and many clubs swapping leagues.
There may be a couple of extra leagues.
But i dont think the changes will be very significant at all this summer.
Perhaps these suggestions might happen over a period of time but not now.
Maybe administratively things may change behind the scenes but to the watching public Step 7 becomes renamed as Regional Feeder Leagues and thats about all there will be to it.
 
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Kingsmere

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I think some feeder leagues below step 7 leagues were sounded out a couple of years ago about becoming step 7. An official of one of them told me about the approach.
 

pitch 63

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Harry West stated -
"I can see the Gloucestershire FA area effectively merged with Herefordshire and southern Worcestershire to come up with two Step 7 leagues i.e. north and south."

I don't know where you got this info from. In Gloucestershire there has been a fixed pyramid below Step 7 (Gloucestershire County League) for many years, maybe a decade. However, at the Glos FA AGM in January a revision was approved made as to which leagues are Step 8 for 2020-21 and that is the existing three Step 8 leagues - Bristol Premier Combination, Bristol & Suburban League and the Gloucestershire Northern Senior League - will also be joined by the Hellenic League Div 2 West. A complicated play-off system at the end of the season will select any clubs to be promoted to the Gloucestershire County League.

However, because it is a 150 mile round trip from the north of Gloucestershire to the clubs in Bristol [and there is also the problem of no crossings of the River Severn for 35 miles], the County FA has allowed the most northern clubs to join other nearer leagues in adjoining counties.
 

Sarumio Whites

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However, because it is a 150 mile round trip from the north of Gloucestershire to the clubs in Bristol [and there is also the problem of no crossings of the River Severn for 35 miles], the County FA has allowed the most northern clubs to join other nearer leagues in adjoining counties.
How very generous of them - so clubs can now join the Warwickshire County League or the Worcestershire County League, neither of which exist.

Or are they specifically saying that teams in the Forest of Dean are free to pursue a life in the Herefordshire League - which would any realistically want to do?

As far as I know there's only one Gloucestershire club currently playing outside of Gloucestershire at Step 7 and below - and that is border club Blockley Sports in the Stratford-upon-Avon Alliance.
 

Cherryhopper

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As far as I know there's only one Gloucestershire club currently playing outside of Gloucestershire at Step 7 and below - and that is border club Blockley Sports in the Stratford-upon-Avon Alliance.
There's also Down Ampney in the Swindon & District League and Marshfield in the Trowbridge & District League, both former Wiltshire League clubs from just over the Gloucestershire border.
 
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Harry West

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Harry West stated -
"I can see the Gloucestershire FA area effectively merged with Herefordshire and southern Worcestershire to come up with two Step 7 leagues i.e. north and south."

I don't know where you got this info from. In Gloucestershire there has been a fixed pyramid below Step 7 (Gloucestershire County League) for many years, maybe a decade. However, at the Glos FA AGM in January a revision was approved made as to which leagues are Step 8 for 2020-21 and that is the existing three Step 8 leagues - Bristol Premier Combination, Bristol & Suburban League and the Gloucestershire Northern Senior League - will also be joined by the Hellenic League Div 2 West. A complicated play-off system at the end of the season will select any clubs to be promoted to the Gloucestershire County League.

However, because it is a 150 mile round trip from the north of Gloucestershire to the clubs in Bristol [and there is also the problem of no crossings of the River Severn for 35 miles], the County FA has allowed the most northern clubs to join other nearer leagues in adjoining counties.
I didn't get it from anywhere. It's just looking at the proposed move in a westward direction for the Hellenic League Prem (and Div One ?) and considering the potential of Glos and Hereford and S Worcs to combine to produce two Step 7 leagues.
 

Harry West

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How very generous of them - so clubs can now join the Warwickshire County League or the Worcestershire County League, neither of which exist.

Or are they specifically saying that teams in the Forest of Dean are free to pursue a life in the Herefordshire League - which would any realistically want to do?

As far as I know there's only one Gloucestershire club currently playing outside of Gloucestershire at Step 7 and below - and that is border club Blockley Sports in the Stratford-upon-Avon Alliance.
Surely it is more about clubs from Herefordshire and South Worcestershire and south Warwickshire, wanting to look south for their football rather than Gloucestershire clubs wanting to go in a northerly direction.

Consider clubs applying to the westerly moving Hellenic League Divs Two:
Kington Town, SK Inkberrow, Shipston Excelsior and Southam United.

On top of that Westfields, Malvern Town, Hereford Pegasus, Hereford Lads Club and Wellington are already there in the Hellenic.
 
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Kingsmere

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There's also Down Ampney in the Swindon & District League and Marshfield in the Trowbridge & District League, both former Wiltshire League clubs from just over the Gloucestershire border.
Sherborne Harriers in the Witney League, which has a few Gloucestershire sides over the years.
 

Sarumio Whites

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Interesting statement released from the Central Midlands League, in direct response to all the bravado that the Doncaster & District Senior League have been putting out in public online.

Also sadly announcing that two Premier Division sides have folded - Askern and Swanwick Pentrich Road (and that they are promoting three sides from their Division Ones to fill the gaps in the Premier Divisions.

They also clarify that the entire league is affiliated at present to the Derbyshire FA!

 

windydcfc

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Interesting statement released from the Central Midlands League, in direct response to all the bravado that the Doncaster & District Senior League have been putting out in public online.

Also sadly announcing that two Premier Division sides have folded - Askern and Swanwick Pentrich Road (and that they are promoting three sides from their Division Ones to fill the gaps in the Premier Divisions.

They also clarify that the entire league is affiliated at present to the Derbyshire FA!

I wonder if they aren’t entirely happy with the 2 clubs joining the Lincs League?
 

kivo

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Askern haven't folded - they've joined the Donny League.
 

Sarumio Whites

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I wonder if they aren’t entirely happy with the 2 clubs joining the Lincs League?
There could definitely be a fight on now for the remaining South Yorkshire clubs in the Central Midlands League - AFC Bentley, Dinnington Town, Phoenix, Sutton Rovers and Thorne Colliery, all of whom may be getting persuaded to move to the Donny League as we speak, with its new found status. And you've only got to look at where those clubs are located to see its a tempting offer to move.

If they were all to move then the CML would be in a LOT of trouble.

They were already two short in one of their Prems last season. They've already lost Appleby Frodingham, Askern and Swanwick from that level and Epworth Town Colts from the level below.

They're almost certain t0 lose another two clubs to Step 6 next summer, and with the huge number of vacancies now at Step 6, they'll be lucky to get anyone back from above.

Is the league on the verge of crumbling and this statement is their only way of venting their helplessness to stop it.
 

windydcfc

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There could definitely be a fight on now for the remaining South Yorkshire clubs in the Central Midlands League - AFC Bentley, Dinnington Town, Phoenix, Sutton Rovers and Thorne Colliery, all of whom may be getting persuaded to move to the Donny League as we speak, with its new found status. And you've only got to look at where those clubs are located to see its a tempting offer to move.

If they were all to move then the CML would be in a LOT of trouble.

They were already two short in one of their Prems last season. They've already lost Appleby Frodingham, Askern and Swanwick from that level and Epworth Town Colts from the level below.

They're almost certain t0 lose another two clubs to Step 6 next summer, and with the huge number of vacancies now at Step 6, they'll be lucky to get anyone back from above.

Is the league on the verge of crumbling and this statement is their only way of venting their helplessness to stop it.
You can add Harworth and Retford Town. Crowle & potentially Collingham could look towards the Lincs League. Collingham have played in the Lincoln League previously and if Newark Town are promoted next season, then Collingham would be extremely isolated.
 

Sarumio Whites

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You can add Harworth and Retford Town. Crowle & potentially Collingham could look towards the Lincs League. Collingham have played in the Lincoln League previously and if Newark Town are promoted next season, then Collingham would be extremely isolated.
Problem is the Lincolnshire League is full with 18 teams now. nly way of Crowle Colts or Collingham getting in would be for someone to resign from the Lincolnshire League next season.

Crowle could however also be getting lured into the Doncaster Senior League...especially if their nearest neighbours, Sutton and Thorne switch! I bet they didn't know what Appleby Frod and Epworth were planning!! Maybe Epworth and AF kept schtum, knowing they might not get in due to limited places, if Crowle were also to apply for the switch!
 

windydcfc

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Problem is the Lincolnshire League is full with 18 teams now. nly way of Crowle Colts or Collingham getting in would be for someone to resign from the Lincolnshire League next season.

Crowle could however also be getting lured into the Doncaster Senior League...especially if their nearest neighbours, Sutton and Thorne switch! I bet they didn't know what Appleby Frod and Epworth were planning!! Maybe Epworth and AF kept schtum, knowing they might not get in due to limited places, if Crowle were also to apply for the switch!
The CML have always been a little bit tetchy about this sort of subject. They have a great opinion about themselves and once had ambitions to get step 6 status & then the EMCL came along and scuppered those ideas. They are probably reading all these posts and blowing a gasket. As far as the 2 Lincolnshire clubs go, I reckon they have told the FA that they don’t want them to go. That’s why they’ve mentioned the constitution’s being released. Lots of things have been mentioned on this forum over the years about the CML and the only one that makes sense is that it should cater for Derbyshire clubs and potentially clubs just outside the county. It wasn’t long ago that Easington was a CML member and had to drive past most Humber League sides and that was insane.
 

Sarumio Whites

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It does seem now to make sense for the 5 South Yorkshire sides to go. And Crowle Colts to join them.

If those clubs were to leave - it would make sense to merge with the Midlands Regional Alliance.

The Central Midlands Regional Alliance has a certain ring to it.

Harworth, Retford United, Newark Town and Collingham would then be the outliers in a predominantly Derbyshire/South Notts league.
 

Cherryhopper

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George & Dragon and Horse & Groom are both New Clubs in the Salisbury area joining the Drew Smith Group Southampton Sat FL. Alderbury and Alderbury Vets, plus Redlynch & Woodfalls United who have 4 teams with us, two mainstream and two Veterans teams i.e. 8 in all. Heritage Window systems no longer exist under that name but will probably be part of the new Clarendon team in the lower Hampshire League 1 (step 8 same as Southampton Premier Div). Thus we have 8 Wilts teams from 4 clubs this coming season. Hope that helps? If you want our full constitution I am happy to post it?
Please do post your constitution of you have it. George & Dragon had a team in the Salisbury Sunday League last season playing home matches at Bishopdown Rec. There is also one Wiltshire team in the City of Southampton Sunday League, RS Nomansland, where I saw my last game on 15th March.
 

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