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Cricket World Cup

 

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Ropemaker
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Jul 11, 2019, 9:27 PM

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Re: [kirby knitters] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I see that India are suggesting that as group winners they should have been given a bye to the final or some sort of second attempt should they have lost a semi final.

So expect some sort of format change for the next WC, which might of course only apply if India are the team it would affect

But having said that if they could extend the competition to two groups of six or seven teams, thus opening out the competition. The playoffs could then be:
Match 1 Winner Group A v Winner Group B
Match 2 Runner up Group A v Runner up Group B
Match 3 Winner Match 2 v Loser Match 1
Final Winner Match 1 v Winner Match 3



Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.


cope1
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Jul 11, 2019, 10:29 PM

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Re: [intheshire] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I agree. In baseball the home team plays in white while the visiting team traditionally wore grey (easier to hide the stains on road trips where it was hard to get stuff laundered between games). Nowadays you have plenty of colourful alternative colours too. For those who care, the home teams usually sported nicknames on their shirts (the home crowd presumably knowing which city they were in) while visitors wore the name of their city/state on their shirts.

In cricket I would prefer that they stuck consistently to colours as many teams, especially domestically, seem to change with the wind. It gives a kind of Sunday league feel of the football variety, where colours are whatever someone picked up cheap. Surely the marketing consultants are familiar with the concept of building a brand!!!


Towlawtom
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Jul 14, 2019, 9:16 PM

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Re: [cope1] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Well that was exciting wasn't it!

For me maybe the greatest one day match or any match ever in my lifetime and even better then the Headingley 81 test match win.

Commiserations to New Zealand who fought well and must feel hard done by especially with Ben Stokes's deflected 6 towards the end.

Wonder if the authorities might eventually change the rules on that.



I need to have the last word, as it always looks as if I am right !


Ropemaker
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Jul 14, 2019, 10:08 PM

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Re: [Towlawtom] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

According to the laws of cricket, 5 runs (not 6) should have been given for the Ben Stokes deflection incident

Stokes and Rashid hadn't crossed for the second run at the instant the throw was made from the boundary so that run shouldn't have counted. Which would also have meant Stokes wouldn't have been on strike for the next ball

Of course, there could be an ICC playing condition to supercede all this



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Part-Timer
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Jul 15, 2019, 12:02 PM

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Re: [Ropemaker] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

What a very odd tiebreaker 'number of boundaries hit' is. Why boundaries rather than sixes? I can't see how it is better that the old 'number of wickets taken' rule (other than the fact that New Zealand would have won under that rule!).


Richard Rundle
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Re: [Part-Timer] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
What a very odd tiebreaker 'number of boundaries hit' is. .


Agreed. And if it is to be a tiebreaker, why not invoke it at the end of the Regulation 50 overs rather than after the extra over?


Ropemaker
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Jul 15, 2019, 1:55 PM

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Re: [Richard Rundle] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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In Reply To
What a very odd tiebreaker 'number of boundaries hit' is. .

Agreed. And if it is to be a tiebreaker, why not invoke it at the end of the Regulation 50 overs rather than after the extra over?

It would have been a different game if England had known a tie would have been enough to win. How would Ben Stokes have played the penultimate ball needing 2 runs off 2 balls instead of 3 off 2?

Bit like the use of red/yellow card count in football, unsuitable but no-one thinks it will be used. And then it is ...



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Tykeoldboy
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Jul 15, 2019, 2:47 PM

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Re: [Ropemaker] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Since an extra day was put aside in case of rain then why not use that extra day if the game is tied after 50 overs (a replay)? Even if admission prices were reduced to say 5 or 10 it would still bring in extra revenue.

Sky have a dedicated cricket channel so they can schedule this and C4 would make room for the game by dropping all the repeats it shows. Both broadcasters will have made plans for Monday play anyway.


Mr. T
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Jul 15, 2019, 4:59 PM

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Post #59 of 81 (476 views)
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Re: [Ropemaker] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
According to the laws of cricket, 5 runs (not 6) should have been given for the Ben Stokes deflection incident

Stokes and Rashid hadn't crossed for the second run at the instant the throw was made from the boundary so that run shouldn't have counted. Which would also have meant Stokes wouldn't have been on strike for the next ball.

I'm not sure that this is so. Law 18 might come into into play.
https://www.lords.org/mcc/laws/scoring-runs


PaulC
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Jul 15, 2019, 5:41 PM

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Post #60 of 81 (457 views)
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Re: [Mr. T] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
According to the laws of cricket, 5 runs (not 6) should have been given for the Ben Stokes deflection incident

Stokes and Rashid hadn't crossed for the second run at the instant the throw was made from the boundary so that run shouldn't have counted. Which would also have meant Stokes wouldn't have been on strike for the next ball.

I'm not sure that this is so. Law 18 might come into into play.
https://www.lords.org/mcc/laws/scoring-runs


19.8 Overthrow or wilful act of fielder

If the boundary results from an overthrow or from the wilful act of a fielder, the runs scored shall be

any runs for penalties awarded to either side

and the allowance for the boundary

and the runs completed by the batsmen, together with the run in progress if they had already crossed at the instant of the throw or act.


They had not crossed for the second run "at the instant of the throw".


Mr. T
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Re: [PaulC] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Correct. I had the 'short run' law in mind.


buncranaboy
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Jul 15, 2019, 11:15 PM

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Post #62 of 81 (381 views)
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Re: [Mr. T] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

When was number of wickets lost dispensed with as a means of settling games with tied scores ?


007Dale
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Jul 16, 2019, 8:20 AM

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Re: [Mr. T] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Its all ifs and buts.

At the end, if wed needed three to win, then hed have played a different shot and aimed for a boundary.

Crickets very own version of the 66 cup final goal...

Thought NZ acted with grace and dignity and played very well throughout. Credit to them and a fantastic final.


Towlawtom
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Jul 16, 2019, 8:51 AM

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Re: [buncranaboy] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
When was number of wickets lost dispensed with as a means of settling games with tied scores ?


Don't follow cricket as much now but according to Wikipedia the superover was introduced in 2008. Not sure if its applied to all 1 day competitions.

Seems a bit odd that its used as a tie breaker if scores are level then you have to introduce another tie breaker if scores are level again after super over.

Didn't see anything wrong with the old rule based on wickets lost. Seemed perfectly fair to me.



I need to have the last word, as it always looks as if I am right !


Mr. T
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Jul 16, 2019, 8:59 AM

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Re: [buncranaboy] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
When was number of wickets lost dispensed with as a means of settling games with tied scores?

A very good question. The first recorded ODI tie (with equal runs but not wickets) was in 1984 but that may have been by prior agreement between the countries. There have been two games (1987 and 1988) that were settled by wickets.

I'm sure wicket count survived for longer in county competitions.


Mr. T
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Jul 16, 2019, 9:21 AM

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Re: [007Dale] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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Its all ifs and buts.

At the end, if wed needed three to win, then hed have played a different shot and aimed for a boundary.

Quite. There are so many incidents in any game that affect its course. Nicholls was given out and looked out but successfully reviewed. Guptill reviewed his dismissal and lost; Taylor was later given out incorrectly but couldn't review. And so on.


Feversham Lens
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Jul 16, 2019, 9:41 AM

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Re: [buncranaboy] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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When was number of wickets lost dispensed with as a means of settling games with tied scores ?

It's used still in league cricket. As recently as June 23, a tied Parish Cup quarter-final between Halifax League clubs (Triangle and Thornton) was settled by wickets lost.


(This post was edited by Feversham Lens on Jul 16, 2019, 9:42 AM)


Towlawtom
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Jul 16, 2019, 10:38 AM

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Post #68 of 81 (271 views)
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Re: [Mr. T] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
When was number of wickets lost dispensed with as a means of settling games with tied scores?

A very good question. The first recorded ODI tie (with equal runs but not wickets) was in 1984 but that may have been by prior agreement between the countries. There have been two games (1987 and 1988) that were settled by wickets.

I'm sure wicket count survived for longer in county competitions.


Fairly sure that would have been an agreement between the countries in a series of 1 day matches between the nations.



I need to have the last word, as it always looks as if I am right !


scottywalds
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Jul 16, 2019, 11:27 AM

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Post #69 of 81 (261 views)
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Re: [Towlawtom] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

Seems a bit odd that its used as a tie breaker if scores are level then you have to introduce another tie breaker if scores are level again after super over.


In football they do it too. It's called a penalty shoot-out (or "kicks from the penalty mark" as called in the Laws of the Game).

Whatever people say, the tie-breakers are decided well in advance of the competition and the teams know this.


Towlawtom
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Jul 16, 2019, 12:03 PM

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Re: [scottywalds] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

Seems a bit odd that its used as a tie breaker if scores are level then you have to introduce another tie breaker if scores are level again after super over.


In football they do it too. It's called a penalty shoot-out (or "kicks from the penalty mark" as called in the Laws of the Game).

Whatever people say, the tie-breakers are decided well in advance of the competition and the teams know this.


Probably misunderstand your point. If after a penalty shoot out 5 kicks each and scores are level they carry on until one side has scored & one missed alternate kicks.
They don't go back to 90 minutes play and see which team had won most corner kicks.



I need to have the last word, as it always looks as if I am right !


buncranaboy
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Jul 16, 2019, 2:23 PM

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Post #71 of 81 (215 views)
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Re: [Towlawtom] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
When was number of wickets lost dispensed with as a means of settling games with tied scores ?


Don't follow cricket as much now but according to Wikipedia the superover was introduced in 2008. Not sure if its applied to all 1 day competitions.

Seems a bit odd that its used as a tie breaker if scores are level then you have to introduce another tie breaker if scores are level again after super over.

Didn't see anything wrong with the old rule based on wickets lost. Seemed perfectly fair to me.



Seems a more satisfactory and transparent method of settling a tie rather than counting up the boundaries.


Ropemaker
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Jul 16, 2019, 2:30 PM

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Re: [Towlawtom] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I don't know if there was a light issue when the game finished but I don't see why there couldn't be more than one super over.

Rules currently permit a maximum of three batsman in a super over ie. two wickets and a side is "all out". Sides also shouldn't be allowed to use the same batsmen or bowlers again if second/subsequent super overs are needed. It would make sense to use ABBA order to save time.

So a side might tie but not have enough batsmen left for another over. So they would lose.



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PaulC
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Jul 16, 2019, 3:39 PM

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Re: [007Dale] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
Its all ifs and buts.

At the end, if wed needed three to win, then hed have played a different shot and aimed for a boundary.

Crickets very own version of the 66 cup final goal...


If England had needed three to win, a new batsman would have been receiving, not Stokes.


Ropemaker
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Re: [PaulC] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
Its all ifs and buts.

At the end, if wed needed three to win, then hed have played a different shot and aimed for a boundary.

Crickets very own version of the 66 cup final goal...


If England had needed three to win, a new batsman would have been receiving, not Stokes.

Could have been either

If England had been given 5 for the Stokes deflection, that would have left Rashid on strike needing 4 off 2 balls so if he'd then got a single Stokes would have needed 3 off the last ball

Then again, 6 for the deflection saw Stokes on strike needing 3 off 2 balls so a new batsman (or Rashid) might then have needed 3 off the last ball if things had worked out differently

All ifs and buts



Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.


scottywalds
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Re: [Towlawtom] Cricket World Cup [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To

Seems a bit odd that its used as a tie breaker if scores are level then you have to introduce another tie breaker if scores are level again after super over.


In football they do it too. It's called a penalty shoot-out (or "kicks from the penalty mark" as called in the Laws of the Game).

Whatever people say, the tie-breakers are decided well in advance of the competition and the teams know this.


Probably misunderstand your point. If after a penalty shoot out 5 kicks each and scores are level they carry on until one side has scored & one missed alternate kicks.
They don't go back to 90 minutes play and see which team had won most corner kicks.


If a football match is drawn (in a cup game), they (usually) use a tie-breaker - extra-time. If this is also a draw, they use a second tie-breaker - a penalty shoot-out.

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