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Home: Games: Twenty Questions:
Twenty Questions #224

 

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mip
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Jan 3, 2010, 10:12 AM

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Post #26 of 49 (1603 views)
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     Re: [chris41] Twenty Questions #224 [In reply to]   or Reply Privately

Was the match played west of the Iron Curtain?

I didn't mention the war, and if I did, I think I got away with it.

B. Fawlty, Esq.


chris41
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Jan 3, 2010, 10:23 AM

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Post #27 of 49 (1599 views)
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In Reply To
Was the match played west of the Iron Curtain?

I didn't mention the war, and if I did, I think I got away with it.

B. Fawlty, Esq.


Yes, This match was played West of the old Iron Curtain..


Jamesie
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Jan 3, 2010, 10:24 AM

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Post #28 of 49 (1597 views)
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     Re: [chris41] Twenty Questions #224 [In reply to]   or

Was this west of Vienna?



Just a note to anyone who is wondering, I am no longer a moderator of this forum due to current personal circumstances and work commitments. If you need help, contact leohoenig or Steve walker. Thank You.


chris41
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Jan 3, 2010, 10:42 AM

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Post #29 of 49 (1593 views)
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Was this west of Vienna?

Yes, this was west of Vienna.


KnowYourMarket
Man City Transfer Target!


Jan 3, 2010, 11:37 AM

Posts: 10973
Location: Longton, Stoke-on-Trent - Ar Bay a Brummie
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Post #30 of 49 (1589 views)
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     Re: [chris41] Twenty Questions #224 [In reply to]   or Reply Privately

Was this game hosted in the home team's country, not a neutral venue?



Last ground visited(update requested by Spud): Wellington . New grounds 18/19: 38


chris41
Man City Transfer Target! / Moderator

Jan 3, 2010, 12:44 PM

Posts: 7256
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Post #31 of 49 (1580 views)
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In Reply To
Was this game hosted in the home team's country, not a neutral venue?

Yes, This game was hosted in the home teams country. Remember also it is the event/events/occurrence as part of the match we are also looking for.


Garrincha's dog
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Jan 3, 2010, 7:27 PM

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Post #32 of 49 (1553 views)
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     Re: [chris41] Twenty Questions #224 [In reply to]   or Reply Privately

Have either of the participants been World Cup winners?


chris41
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Jan 3, 2010, 7:44 PM

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Post #33 of 49 (1548 views)
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Have either of the participants been World Cup winners?


No GD, Neither of the participants have been world cup winners.


mip
Man City Transfer Target! / Moderator


Jan 4, 2010, 6:03 AM

Posts: 9850
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Post #34 of 49 (1519 views)
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Was the match played in one of the BeNeLux contries?


chris41
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Jan 4, 2010, 9:29 AM

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Post #35 of 49 (1510 views)
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Was the match played in one of the BeNeLux contries?

Yes, the match was played in one of the Benelux Countries.

The event/occurence as part of this match was well publicised at the time but does not appear to be that well publicised on the web, maybe because it is not recent. If you can find the 2 teams who played in that game, you should be able to find some web links that will help. This may be answered correctly by someone who may remember reading about it rather then trawling through loads of weblinks but the info is out there to be found.

There were some similarities to the event/occurrence from that match that were played out in another well known publicised match last year.


mip
Man City Transfer Target! / Moderator


Jan 4, 2010, 9:54 AM

Posts: 9850
Location: Odense
Team(s): Portsmouth, OB, Svendborg fB, Tved B

Post #36 of 49 (1503 views)
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In Reply To

In Reply To
Was the match played in one of the BeNeLux contries?

Yes, the match was played in one of the Benelux Countries.

The event/occurence as part of this match was well publicised at the time but does not appear to be that well publicised on the web, maybe because it is not recent. If you can find the 2 teams who played in that game, you should be able to find some web links that will help. This may be answered correctly by someone who may remember reading about it rather then trawling through loads of weblinks but the info is out there to be found.

There were some similarities to the event/occurrence from that match that were played out in another well known publicised match last year.

Just to clarify for someone whose brain is not yet fully adjusted to being in year 2010, by last year do you then mean 2009?


chris41
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Jan 4, 2010, 10:05 AM

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Post #37 of 49 (1499 views)
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In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
Was the match played in one of the BeNeLux contries?

Yes, the match was played in one of the Benelux Countries.

The event/occurence as part of this match was well publicised at the time but does not appear to be that well publicised on the web, maybe because it is not recent. If you can find the 2 teams who played in that game, you should be able to find some web links that will help. This may be answered correctly by someone who may remember reading about it rather then trawling through loads of weblinks but the info is out there to be found.

There were some similarities to the event/occurrence from that match that were played out in another well known publicised match last year.

Just to clarify for someone whose brain is not yet fully adjusted to being in year 2010, by last year do you then mean 2009?

Yes, last year meaning 2009.


Jamesie
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Jan 4, 2010, 10:38 AM

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Post #38 of 49 (1491 views)
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     Re: [chris41] Twenty Questions #224 [In reply to]   or

Was this game in the Netherlands?



Just a note to anyone who is wondering, I am no longer a moderator of this forum due to current personal circumstances and work commitments. If you need help, contact leohoenig or Steve walker. Thank You.


chris41
Man City Transfer Target! / Moderator

Jan 4, 2010, 10:44 AM

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Post #39 of 49 (1487 views)
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Was this game in the Netherlands?

Yes, the game was played in the Netherlands.


MadMick
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Jan 4, 2010, 12:11 PM

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Post #40 of 49 (1475 views)
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Q: Did this event occur before 1960?


chris41
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Jan 4, 2010, 12:20 PM

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Post #41 of 49 (1473 views)
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Q: Did this event occur before 1960?

No, it did not occur before 1960.


mip
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Jan 4, 2010, 12:24 PM

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Post #42 of 49 (1470 views)
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I'll have a pop at the Netherlands v Belgium qualifying game played on 18th November 1973 in Amsterdam. The decisive qualifier for the 1974 World Cup with The Netherland and Belgium even on points but The Netherlands having the better goal difference (first time goal difference was used as a tie-breaker in WC qualifying I believe). The event: In the 89th minute Belgium had what looked like a perfectly OK goal following a freekick ruled out for offside.


chris41
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Jan 4, 2010, 1:17 PM

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Post #43 of 49 (1452 views)
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I'll have a pop at the Netherlands v Belgium qualifying game played on 18th November 1973 in Amsterdam. The decisive qualifier for the 1974 World Cup with The Netherland and Belgium even on points but The Netherlands having the better goal difference (first time goal difference was used as a tie-breaker in WC qualifying I believe). The event: In the 89th minute Belgium had what looked like a perfectly OK goal following a freekick ruled out for offside.


Congratulations you are correct - we have a winner !!!!!! Well done Mip !

Your answer is close enough as you have described the event/occurrence and the immediate aftermath was that The Netherlands qualified for the 1974 world cup and not Belgium.

The event that I chose was the World cup qualifying match played in 1973 between the Netherlands and Belgium and the controversial disallowed goal which would have meant that Belgium and not the Netherlands would have qualified for the 1974 world cup finals in West Germany

I chose this event because of the obvious similarities between that game and the recent world cup playoff game between France and Ireland with the Thierry Henry handball incident which meant that Ireland would also not be going to the world cup finals

In that 1974 world cup qualifying campaign, Belgium were incredibly unlucky not to qualify ahead of the dutch in that world cup qualifying group. In that last group game against The Netherlands they had to win in Amsterdam to go through due to the Netherlands superior goal difference. The match was 0-0 up until the last minute when Belgium were given a free kick. Belgiumís captain Paul van Himst took the free kick and Jan Verheyan beat the offside trap and was denied what looked like a certain goal.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cWwulNygvs

If you freeze the clip at approx 1.19 at the time van Himst strikes the ball apparently at least 3 of the dutch defenders are playing Verheyan onside.
Also there are contradictory reports on the web as to who the Belgian scorer was with the majority stating it was Jan Verheyan and a few others stating it was Leon Semmeling, so I was not concerned about identifying the Belgian goalscorer. I donít speak dutch but I am hoping the commentary confirms Verheyan as the goalscorer. Belgium must be the only country to have been knocked out of a world cup qualifying campaign without conceding a goal.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/...tory-holland-belgium

Another interesting observation if the Belgians had gone through is that the phrase Total Football given to the dutch side in that period would not have existed and would have denied Johann Cruyff of appearing in the finals of a world cup.
So perhaps a good thing for many football fans that it was The Netherlands that appeared in the 1974 world cup and not Belgium.

So itís over to you Michael.

.
.


(This post was edited by chris41 on Jan 4, 2010, 1:19 PM)


KnowYourMarket
Man City Transfer Target!


Jan 4, 2010, 1:28 PM

Posts: 10973
Location: Longton, Stoke-on-Trent - Ar Bay a Brummie
Team(s): WBA, FC Saarbruecken, Brierley Hill Alliance (RIP)

Post #44 of 49 (1443 views)
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Was the game involved a friendly?



Last ground visited(update requested by Spud): Wellington . New grounds 18/19: 38


mip
Man City Transfer Target! / Moderator


Jan 4, 2010, 1:41 PM

Posts: 9850
Location: Odense
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Post #45 of 49 (1437 views)
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In Reply To

In Reply To
I'll have a pop at the Netherlands v Belgium qualifying game played on 18th November 1973 in Amsterdam. The decisive qualifier for the 1974 World Cup with The Netherland and Belgium even on points but The Netherlands having the better goal difference (first time goal difference was used as a tie-breaker in WC qualifying I believe). The event: In the 89th minute Belgium had what looked like a perfectly OK goal following a freekick ruled out for offside.


Congratulations you are correct - we have a winner !!!!!! Well done Mip !

Your answer is close enough as you have described the event/occurrence and the immediate aftermath was that The Netherlands qualified for the 1974 world cup and not Belgium.

The event that I chose was the World cup qualifying match played in 1973 between the Netherlands and Belgium and the controversial disallowed goal which would have meant that Belgium and not the Netherlands would have qualified for the 1974 world cup finals in West Germany

I chose this event because of the obvious similarities between that game and the recent world cup playoff game between France and Ireland with the Thierry Henry handball incident which meant that Ireland would also not be going to the world cup finals

In that 1974 world cup qualifying campaign, Belgium were incredibly unlucky not to qualify ahead of the dutch in that world cup qualifying group. In that last group game against The Netherlands they had to win in Amsterdam to go through due to the Netherlands superior goal difference. The match was 0-0 up until the last minute when Belgium were given a free kick. Belgiumís captain Paul van Himst took the free kick and Jan Verheyan beat the offside trap and was denied what looked like a certain goal.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cWwulNygvs

If you freeze the clip at approx 1.19 at the time van Himst strikes the ball apparently at least 3 of the dutch defenders are playing Verheyan onside.
Also there are contradictory reports on the web as to who the Belgian scorer was with the majority stating it was Jan Verheyan and a few others stating it was Leon Semmeling, so I was not concerned about identifying the Belgian goalscorer. I donít speak dutch but I am hoping the commentary confirms Verheyan as the goalscorer. Belgium must be the only country to have been knocked out of a world cup qualifying campaign without conceding a goal.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/...tory-holland-belgium

Another interesting observation if the Belgians had gone through is that the phrase Total Football given to the dutch side in that period would not have existed and would have denied Johann Cruyff of appearing in the finals of a world cup.
So perhaps a good thing for many football fans that it was The Netherlands that appeared in the 1974 world cup and not Belgium.

So itís over to you Michael.

.
.

Had a look at the youtube video. The "scorer" as far as I can see is number 9 who would've been Leon Semmeling according to http://rdfc.com.ne.kr/int/ned-intres-1970.html. Jan Verhayen was number 7 and is seen at the left wing after the "goal" was scored. The referee might have given the offside against the Belgian number 4 but even he appears onside when you stop the video at 1.19.

I know the Henry-thing has been done to dead on this forum and elsewhere but just one point: Even if the Henry goal had been disallowed (as it of course should have been), Ireland would still had needed to win in extra time or win a penalty shoot out to qualify.


Lars
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Jan 4, 2010, 2:23 PM

Posts: 900
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Post #46 of 49 (1423 views)
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Good choice Chris!
It is interesting to think how different things could have been, not only in this case but in lots of other cases too.
This is something I often think is overlooked, not only in football but in other cases too.

I remember Italy getting eliminated vs South Korea, after having goals disallowed. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Pm4jD5kU4U Considering Italy's usual habit of getting better and better thoughout tournaments, how far would they have went if they had won?

How about if Maradona's hand ball vs England? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbbsytHDp2o (I hope I don't get banned for posting this. Wink) Maradona went on the be the king of the world cup, leading Argentina to the gold medal

There are so many examples, and not only in football.

What if Kenneth Andersson hadn't scored that late goal vs Rumania in the 1994 World Cup, and we hadn't won the following penalty shootout? Well, we probably would have come home a bit disappointed, instead of eventually winning bronze medal and see the players come home as heroes.
What if Anders Svensson had scored vs Senegal in the 2002 World Cup 1/8-final, instead of hitting the goal post? Well, it would have been a golden goal, putting us through to the 1/4-finals, instead of seing Senegal later on scoring a somewhat lucky goal to eliminate us.
What if England had won the penalties vs... well for example Holland?

You are right about the football world having been denied of Holland and Cruyff. It also probably would have meant Holland would get a tougher qualifying for the next European Championship and World Cup, and so on...
However... Holland might have equalized later, if the Belgian goal had been allowed.
Just like France might have won anyway vs Ireland.

I sort of knew this was the correct answer, but felt obligated to letting mip getting the opportunity to win, he he he. Wink


mip
Man City Transfer Target! / Moderator


Jan 4, 2010, 2:28 PM

Posts: 9850
Location: Odense
Team(s): Portsmouth, OB, Svendborg fB, Tved B

Post #47 of 49 (1418 views)
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Cheer up Lars, you still have the chance to become the first Swedish 20Q winner in 2010 Smile.


chris41
Man City Transfer Target! / Moderator

Jan 4, 2010, 2:30 PM

Posts: 7256
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Post #48 of 49 (1417 views)
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Yes it still appears contradictory as to who the player was who put the ball in the back of the net. If the Rsssf website is to be believed there is no way it could have been Jan Verheyan as he was number 7. Very strange how many of the internet sources identify him as the goalscorer including this reporter from the planet world cup website. http://www.planetworldcup.com/...TS/ruud20020208.html

Even in a british newspaper archive from next day the player was Identified as Jan Verheyan.

Fair point regarding the Thierry Henry handball incident that Ireland may not have gone through but would have had a 50% chance perhaps in a penalty shoot-out


chris41
Man City Transfer Target! / Moderator

Jan 4, 2010, 2:46 PM

Posts: 7256
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Post #49 of 49 (1411 views)
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In Reply To
Good choice Chris!
It is interesting to think how different things could have been, not only in this case but in lots of other cases too.
This is something I often think is overlooked, not only in football but in other cases too.

I remember Italy getting eliminated vs South Korea, after having goals disallowed. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Pm4jD5kU4U Considering Italy's usual habit of getting better and better thoughout tournaments, how far would they have went if they had won?

How about if Maradona's hand ball vs England? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbbsytHDp2o (I hope I don't get banned for posting this. Wink) Maradona went on the be the king of the world cup, leading Argentina to the gold medal

There are so many examples, and not only in football.

What if Kenneth Andersson hadn't scored that late goal vs Rumania in the 1994 World Cup, and we hadn't won the following penalty shootout? Well, we probably would have come home a bit disappointed, instead of eventually winning bronze medal and see the players come home as heroes.
What if Anders Svensson had scored vs Senegal in the 2002 World Cup 1/8-final, instead of hitting the goal post? Well, it would have been a golden goal, putting us through to the 1/4-finals, instead of seing Senegal later on scoring a somewhat lucky goal to eliminate us.
What if England had won the penalties vs... well for example Holland?

You are right about the football world having been denied of Holland and Cruyff. It also probably would have meant Holland would get a tougher qualifying for the next European Championship and World Cup, and so on...
However... Holland might have equalized later, if the Belgian goal had been allowed.
Just like France might have won anyway vs Ireland.

I sort of knew this was the correct answer, but felt obligated to letting mip getting the opportunity to win, he he he. Wink

Lars, interesting that link with Diego Maradona that you have posted obviously still hurts. Perhaps Jamesie should remove it.Wink

We have a saying in Britain called "What goes around comes around " and in the next two world cup matches against Argentina in 1998 and 2002, I thought that England were given two very fortunate penalties both committed against Michael Owen ( I think). So we did get a little of our own back for that Maradona incident.

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