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Home: Non-League Football Discussion: Restructuring Discussion:
South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20

 

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paulh66
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Sep 20, 2018, 11:58 AM

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Re: [SWP-Phil] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

And the standardised wording in NLS Regulation 7.2 states:
"Reserve teams, including a team from a club or Club which is not considered by the Committee to be sufficiently separate from another club or Club, will not be permitted to compete above Step 6 in the NLS. There must be a minimum of two Steps between a first and reserve team. This does not apply at Steps 6 & 7. No two teams from the same Club can play at the same Step. Reserve teams currently at Step 5 can remain unless relegated, once relegated they will not be permitted to be promoted back to Step 5."


keneastlancs
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Sep 20, 2018, 2:21 PM

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Post #27 of 47 (7745 views)
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Re: [SWP-Phil] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
Opinions - its why its such a great game - ohh and I don't disagree with all of yours by any means, but I have had to negotiate with those in London who of course always know best.

Argyle Reserves ineligible as Western Lge rules state no reserve teams may join (Reserves rule in the standardised wording being upto individual leagues to determine)


Also no reserve teams above step 6


Sarumio
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Sep 20, 2018, 2:21 PM

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Post #28 of 47 (7745 views)
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Re: [paulh66] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Indeed - the Standardised Rules bvery much trump any rules the Western League try to impose.

I believe the Northern League, much like the Western League have this rule, but have been told in no uncertain terms that if Hebburn Town Reserves apply for promotion and win the Weraside League, the FA will force the Northern League to accept them (providing of course Hebbirn Town's first team go up to the NPL).

So as far as I can see, there is nothing stopping Plymouth Argle Resefves from going up (although with so many Bristol, South Glos and Wiltshire sides in the Western Prem, I very much doubt they see any point in going up at present.


paulh66
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Sep 20, 2018, 2:27 PM

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Post #29 of 47 (7734 views)
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Re: [Sarumio] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

 
So as far as I can see, there is nothing stopping Plymouth Argle Resefves from going up (although with so many Bristol, South Glos and Wiltshire sides in the Western Prem, I very much doubt they see any point in going up at present.


The rule I just quoted very clearly prevents Argyle reserves from going up.


Sarumio
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Sep 20, 2018, 4:32 PM

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Post #30 of 47 (7651 views)
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Re: [paulh66] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
So as far as I can see, there is nothing stopping Plymouth Argle Resefves from going up (although with so many Bristol, South Glos and Wiltshire sides in the Western Prem, I very much doubt they see any point in going up at present.


The rule I just quoted very clearly prevents Argyle reserves from going up.


Yes...you are of course right - forgoetting the SWPL Prem was at Step 6...D'oh!


Unicorn
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Sep 21, 2018, 8:46 AM

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Post #31 of 47 (7352 views)
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Re: [paulh66] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

So at step 6 both Hellenic divisions, both Eastern senior League divisions and both SWP divisions will have reserve teams.
The only others will be Dorking Wanderers and Phoenix Sports.( at the moment anyway).

Has anything been said about the names for the two SWP divisions. Sorry if it has but i have not seen it.


SWP-Phil
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Sep 21, 2018, 8:56 AM

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Post #32 of 47 (7346 views)
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Re: [Unicorn] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Nothing set in stone but "Premier East" and "Premier West" are the working titles.



_______________________________________________

Follow the SW Peninsula League on Twitter: @swpleague

For all the News on the SW Peninsula League go to : www.swpleague.co.uk


Sarumio
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Sep 21, 2018, 9:20 AM

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Post #33 of 47 (7333 views)
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Re: [Unicorn] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
So at step 6 both Hellenic divisions, both Eastern senior League divisions and both SWP divisions will have reserve teams.
The only others will be Dorking Wanderers and Phoenix Sports.( at the moment anyway)


Well, apart from Plymouth Parkway Reserves and Buckland Athletic Reserves, no other resevres can be elected, at present to either of the new SWPL Prems at Step 6.


SWP-Phil
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Sep 21, 2018, 9:28 AM

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Post #34 of 47 (7327 views)
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Re: [Sarumio] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Truro City, Bideford, Barnstaple, Tiverton, Exeter City & Torquay could all join that list.



_______________________________________________

Follow the SW Peninsula League on Twitter: @swpleague

For all the News on the SW Peninsula League go to : www.swpleague.co.uk


Unicorn
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Sep 21, 2018, 9:38 AM

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Post #35 of 47 (7314 views)
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Re: [SWP-Phil] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
Nothing set in stone but "Premier East" and "Premier West" are the working titles.


Hope thats your idea Phil.
Because if the FA arrange it the Premier East will be Cornwall and the Premier West will be Devon.Cool


SWP-Phil
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Sep 21, 2018, 9:40 AM

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Post #36 of 47 (7303 views)
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Re: [Unicorn] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Don't tempt me ! I'm trying REALLY hard not to be my normal callous, mean, sarcastic & offensive self when trying to both Interpret or Execute the FA's plan !!!



_______________________________________________

Follow the SW Peninsula League on Twitter: @swpleague

For all the News on the SW Peninsula League go to : www.swpleague.co.uk


Geoff
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Sep 21, 2018, 9:43 AM

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Post #37 of 47 (7296 views)
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Re: [Unicorn] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Am I alone in getting a feeling of dťjŗ vu or are we back to the days of the South Western & Devon County Leagues, but with them now being at step 6 rather than step 7.
As for names surely they should be Cornwall Premier Division & England Premier Division


oftenscore6
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Sep 21, 2018, 1:27 PM

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Post #38 of 47 (7139 views)
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Re: [Geoff] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

If the example of refusing promotion from Andover Town is followed, each Cornish champion will be back at step 7 the following year - it might quickly become known as the guaranteed relegation spot! If a geographic exception is named, Northern league area sides will be asking for the same as well, I'd expect. And with hardly any teams in levels above step 6, these 2 SWP Premier divisions are unlikely to get many if any relegatees from above - which under the pooling principle now operating means the 'Devon' division will start heading towards Bristol, with the east Devon clubs moved into the Cornwall setup and back in a division difficult to get out of.

Geography is a natural barrier and the FA should leave well alone and step back from getting involved in step 5 & 6 promotion/relegation and allow the natural setup to be adopted by the local associations. In this case, any ambitious Devon clubs should be able to get promoted as the highest placed suitable applicant rather than making them win the divisions or be runner-up with a higer ppg than some teams in the rest of the country. This would clubs wishing to remain at the level to do so, whilst not hindering those with ambitions.



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15/12 Abbey Hulton United?
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(This post was edited by oftenscore6 on Sep 21, 2018, 1:27 PM)


Richard Rundle
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Sep 21, 2018, 1:30 PM

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Post #39 of 47 (7135 views)
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Re: [Geoff] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
As for names surely they should be Cornwall Premier Division & England Premier Division


No, because the border between the two divisions will not be fixed at the Tamar.


Richard Rundle
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Sep 21, 2018, 1:39 PM

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Re: [SWP-Phil] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
The two reasons are

1) The geography and (lack of) transport infrastructure of the region

2) The fact that the Cornish clubs will not (for whatever reason good or bad) take promotion to Step 5, whilst Devon based clubs cannot take promotion as they currently play in a division that is dominated by those Cornish clubs, hence 13/6 split and the 6 includes 3 West Devon clubs not including Argyle reserves who are ineligible to go up anyway.



Can we just take a look at Point 2) for a moment?

Winners of the Premier Division since the SWP was formed

2007-08 Bodmin Town (C) not promoted
2008-09 Bodmin Town (C) not promoted
2009-10 Buckland Athletic (D) not promoted
2010-11 Buckland Athletic (D) not promoted
2011-12 Bodmin Town (C) not promoted
2012-13 Bodmin Town (C) not promoted
2013-14 Plymouth Parkway (D) not promoted
2014-15 AFC St Austell (C) not promoted
2015-16 Bodmin Town (C) not promoted
2016-17 Tavistock (D) not promoted
2017-18 Plymouth Parkway(D) - PROMOTED

So only 6-4 to the Cornish side of the border not taking promotion. Doesn't look like domination to me. And 5 of them being the "fault" of just one club. Buckland and Parkway also finished in the top 3 several times before moving up, and Exmouth and Elburton have also finished in the top 3 once each.

So the FA are using a sledgehammer to crack a nut based in Priory Park


philglossop
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Sep 22, 2018, 5:59 AM

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Post #41 of 47 (6866 views)
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Re: [Richard Rundle] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

And didnít the Western League reject St Austell in their title winning season? That could have been interesting- an FA Vase finalist not good enough for Step 5!!!

Some may say the simple solution would have been a Step 5 league covering Cornwall/Devon/West Somerset/West Dorset, a Western League covering Somerset and an Hellenic League covering the M4 corridor?

But if Bodmin Town donít go up we need like Richard said- sledgehammer time.

And letís be fair, the days when it took nearly 3 hrs from Plymouth to Penzance are gone but you try getting rid of that mentality in the Duchy!

Itís a joke.


Geoff
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Sep 22, 2018, 10:50 AM

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Post #42 of 47 (6739 views)
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Re: [Richard Rundle] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

While it is true that the ratio is only 6-4 both Parkway & Tavistock are in the far west of Devon so, if we say ďin or borderingĒ Cornwall the ratio becomes 9 out of 11.
The journey times from Penzance to Plymouth (2 hours on a very good day) is irrelevant, that is a single game in a season of 19 away games and the rest of the division are east of Exeter, most of them some considerable distance east.
I still fail to see why clubs should be effectively forced to take promotion if they donít want to. Simply promote the best placed club in each division which meets the criteria. Any promoted cub will probably make wholesale changes to their playing squad anyway to replace players who donít want the extra traveling and strengthen so, in many ways, the previous seasonís performance is not relevant.
In the case of the south west the system seems to work reasonably well. No one club totally dominates the league year after year (not that long ago the likes of St Blazey & Portleven were among the big beasts) and clubs that wish to can progress. The first time I saw Plymouth Parkway they were called EAF Flyers and were in the Plymouth & District League and have gradually built their support and infrastructure so they now feel they can make a go of Western League football.
Overall it seems to me that football in the far south west ainít broke so why try to fix it.


Sarumio
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Sep 22, 2018, 1:21 PM

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Post #43 of 47 (6671 views)
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Re: [Richard Rundle] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

So the FA are using a sledgehammer to crack a nut based in Priory Park


So are you insinuating that this whole unnecessary restructure of the SWPL has come about as a result of one club's refusal to seek promotion over and over again....Bodmin Town!


Richard Rundle
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Nov 29, 2018, 4:18 PM

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Re: [Sarumio] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Press release from the SWP League dated yesterday (28/11/18) afternoon


PRIORITY FOR FILLING NEW STEP SIX DIVISIONS

From next season the South West Peninsula League will be operating two Divisions at Step 6 (the same as the current Premier Division). In order to populate these divisions, clubs have been invited to apply to the FA by December 31st. Once the full list of applicants is known it is important that the process of selecting them is transparent, so we have agreed the following process:

The two Divisions will each operate under the control of the South West Peninsula League Ltd, who in turn operate under the auspices of the FA at Wembley and itís Leagues Committee.
In pursuance of the National League System Regulations the yearly make-up of the divisions is governed by The FA, and any club may be required to move in a lateral manner to ensure an even distribution of clubs.

Whilst its expected that the Premier West will be mainly Cornish and the Premier East will be mainly Devon, this is not assured.
Clubs in Devon MAY be moved to an alternative Step 6 Division (Western League) and/or clubs not based in Devon & Cornwall may be moved into the SW Peninsula League Ė all such matters would be for the leagues committee to rule on and any decision would be appealable to that committee.

Assuming however that the initial constitution is filled by clubs in Devon & Cornwall, the following priority of allocating the maximum of 40 spaces is:

Priority Group ONE:

Clubs who are this season operating in the SWP Premier Division and have not given notice to withdraw by March 31st or been promoted to Step 5 for the following season.

Priority Group TWO:

Clubs who in ďany other seasonĒ would be entitled to be in Step 6 Ė Examples are any club relegated from Step 5, any clubs who would have been Promoted from Step 7 and any club laterally transferred or placed in the Division by the FA.

Priority Group THREE:

Clubs who are members of SWP East or SWP West who hold (on March 31st 2019) an FA Ground Grading of G or H including the installation of floodlighting.
Examples include East & West clubs who were (or could have been) entrants in this seasons FA Vase.

Priority Group FOUR:

Clubs who are members of SWP East or SWP West who, on March 31st 2019, can satisfy the league and the FA that they already meet FA Ground Grading H including active planning permission for any required works including the installation of floodlighting, and give assurances to reach G in full by March 31st 2021.

Should 36 or more clubs (maximum 40) be accepted from groups 1 to 4 inclusive, then no other clubs will be considered for membership.
If less than 36 we may look at:

Priority Group FIVE:

Clubs who are members of SWP East or SWP West who, on March 31st 2019, do not meet FA Ground Grading H, but can satisfy the league AND The FA that they can meet FA Ground Grading G, including the installation of floodlighting, by March 31st 2021.

Clubs accepted under Priority Groups Four & Five will be required to provide a detailed plan and costings of the required work (including grants) and provide a written commitment to meet G in full by March 31st 2021 and further accept that failure to comply WILL result in relegation at the end of the 2020/21 season irrespective of league position.

Clubs in Groups 4 & 5 will not be eligible for promotion to Step 5 or entry into FA Cup or FA Vase, until such time as they have reached the required FA ground grading.

IF spaces remain unfilled from Groups 1 to 5 ONLY, then:

Clubs in the feeder leagues with grounds achieving, or committed to achieve, Grade G by March 31st 2021 may be considered.
Any such clubs will require the FAís approval to be placed directly at Step 6 and need to provide a detailed background to justify such promotion, it is not sufficient for the SWP alone to allow promotion. League positions of such clubs would also have to demonstrate an ability to compete at Step 6.

ALL clubs Ė irrespective of which division or league they are now in ĖMust apply to the FA by December 31st.


swjoduk
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Dec 4, 2018, 9:45 AM

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Post #45 of 47 (2534 views)
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Re: [SWP-Phil] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

How about reserves from Taunton Town, Weston Super Mare, even Yeovil?

The FA may say you have to take clubs from Somerset.

Maybe Chard would want to switch?


Andy Mac
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Dec 5, 2018, 9:51 PM

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Post #46 of 47 (1899 views)
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Re: [swjoduk] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
How about reserves from Taunton Town, Weston Super Mare, even Yeovil?

The FA may say you have to take clubs from Somerset.

Maybe Chard would want to switch?


At what step do those reserve teams play?


swjoduk
Reserve Team Regular

Dec 5, 2018, 10:44 PM

Posts: 685
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Post #47 of 47 (1828 views)
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Re: [Andy Mac] South West Peninsula League area from 2019-20 [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

They donít, well apart from Chard who play at step 9 or 10?? Devon and Exeter League, same as Wellington reserves

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