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Just not cricket

 



Ropemaker
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Aug 29, 2017, 3:34 PM

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Just not cricket Can't Post or Reply Privately

Shenanigans in Pembrokeshire Division One title decider.

Carew declared last game of season against Cresselly on 18/1. So lost the match but denial of bonus points to opponents means they won the title by a point

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/wales/41074513

In the league I umpire in the team batting second would receive maximum batting points for winning with a score under 200, so they've have needed a bigger lead in the table Smile



Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.


PaulC
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Aug 29, 2017, 4:48 PM

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Re: [Ropemaker] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
Shenanigans in Pembrokeshire Division One title decider.

Carew declared last game of season against Cresselly on 18/1. So lost the match but denial of bonus points to opponents means they won the title by a point

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/wales/41074513

In the league I umpire in the team batting second would receive maximum batting points for winning with a score under 200, so they've have needed a bigger lead in the table Smile


I hope the league can charge them with bringing the game into disrepute by deliberately 'throwing' a match.


Tykeoldboy
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Aug 29, 2017, 5:24 PM

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Re: [PaulC] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

A 2 point deduction would seem a far punishment if found guilty of breaking any league rules.


Steelback
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Aug 29, 2017, 8:32 PM

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Re: [Ropemaker] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Worcestershire did the same thing in 2003 in the Div 2 final game title decider v Northamptonshire, declaring when 8 down to stop Northamptonshire getting a final bonus point.

Get rid of bonus points and you don't have this problem plus more teams would try to win games rather than settle for a high scoring draw



Northamptonshire Steelbacks 2013 & 2016 T20 Winners


jon b
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Aug 29, 2017, 11:48 PM

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Re: [Ropemaker] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Shades of Trevor Chappell's 1981 underarm ball.

No doubt, as with the above, it'll result in a rule change.


Ropemaker
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Aug 30, 2017, 12:23 AM

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Re: [jon b] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

In 1979, Somerset declared in a Benson and Hedges Cup Group game v Worcestershire after 1 over, losing the game but protecting their "strike rate" to ensure qualification.

However, they were expelled from the competition for bringing the game into disrepute.



Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.


AnotherGlassboy
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Aug 30, 2017, 11:11 AM

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In 1979, Somerset declared in a Benson and Hedges Cup Group game v Worcestershire after 1 over, losing the game but protecting their "strike rate" to ensure qualification.

However, they were expelled from the competition for bringing the game into disrepute.


Indeed, I remember it well, and it was the first thing I thought of when I read this story. Brian Rose was the Somerset captain.

Somerset hadn't actually broken any rules/laws, and their expulsion was a little spurious (even though I'm a Worcs man).

However, it should be noted that the vote to expel them was 16 to 1, and Somerset actually voted in favour of being expelled. I think it was Derbyshire who voted against.

The laws were subsequently changed (though not at all levels, it would seem) to outlaw declarations in limited overs cricket.


(This post was edited by AnotherGlassboy on Aug 30, 2017, 11:12 AM)


AnotherGlassboy
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Aug 30, 2017, 11:14 AM

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Worcestershire did the same thing in 2003 in the Div 2 final game title decider v Northamptonshire, declaring when 8 down to stop Northamptonshire getting a final bonus point.

Get rid of bonus points and you don't have this problem plus more teams would try to win games rather than settle for a high scoring draw


I'm sure that's far from unique. Declarations in "first class" cricket are a slightly different kettle of fish, although I take your point.

EDIT - besides, we were only getting our own back for the day Geoff Cook refused to follow on at New Road (he actually pretended he hadn't seen Phil Neale's signal), and both teams came out to field!

FURTHER EDIT - Not the only Worcs/Northants declaration furore...

https://theviewfromlightwoodspark.wordpress.com/tag/geoff-boycott/

I was there to witness the Cook/Neale incident. It was towards the end of the day, only about six overs left or so. It wasn't sorted out until overnight calls to Lords, and the upshot was Northants did indeed follow on, with those missing overs tagged on to the next day's play.


(This post was edited by AnotherGlassboy on Aug 30, 2017, 11:20 AM)


Ropemaker
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Aug 30, 2017, 12:21 PM

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Re: [AnotherGlassboy] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


Indeed, I remember it well, and it was the first thing I thought of when I read this story. Brian Rose was the Somerset captain.

...

The laws were subsequently changed (though not at all levels, it would seem) to outlaw declarations in limited overs cricket.

The Pembroke incident was in a declaration game, a format used in many leagues up and down the country.

There, the game was of 90 overs duration. The team batting first can bat up to 45 overs (or whatever limit has been set) but can declare at any time.

The bowling side then get the remaining overs to score the runs or be bowled out. Otherwise the game is a draw (or possibly tie of course).



Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.


acmold
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Aug 30, 2017, 1:45 PM

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Post #10 of 17 (4086 views)
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Shenanigans in Pembrokeshire Division One title decider.

Carew declared last game of season against Cresselly on 18/1. So lost the match but denial of bonus points to opponents means they won the title by a point

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/wales/41074513

In the league I umpire in the team batting second would receive maximum batting points for winning with a score under 200, so they've have needed a bigger lead in the table Smile


Discussed on TSM along with cheating in Chess, a Grandmaster was going to the toilet after ever move. He had a phone hidden and was putting ever move into chess program to get advice. Not all chocolate cakes and pigeons.


Ropemaker
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Aug 30, 2017, 2:44 PM

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Re: [acmold] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


Discussed on TSM along with cheating in Chess, a Grandmaster was going to the toilet after ever move. He had a phone hidden and was putting ever move into chess program to get advice. Not all chocolate cakes and pigeons.

Reminds me of a story I read once

A chess Grandmaster was playing ten games BLINDFOLDED at the same time. The trick in this being to keep the games as different as possible but the ten players had got together beforehand and agreed to play the same moves but in a different order.

So a hopelessly confused Grandmaster excused himself to the toilet and made his escape via a window



Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.


Ropemaker
Man City Transfer Target!

Sep 15, 2017, 12:31 PM

Posts: 7335
Location: Surrey
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Re: [PaulC] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
Shenanigans in Pembrokeshire Division One title decider.

Carew declared last game of season against Cresselly on 18/1. So lost the match but denial of bonus points to opponents means they won the title by a point

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/wales/41074513

In the league I umpire in the team batting second would receive maximum batting points for winning with a score under 200, so they've have needed a bigger lead in the table Smile

I hope the league can charge them with bringing the game into disrepute by deliberately 'throwing' a match.

Carew to face disrepute charge. Hearing due on 26 Sep

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/wales/41253545



Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.

(This post was edited by Ropemaker on Sep 15, 2017, 12:33 PM)


broodleyhoo
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Sep 15, 2017, 3:36 PM

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Post #13 of 17 (3324 views)
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Re: [Ropemaker] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Can't agree with the general condemnation.

Rules is rules - and the point of being a smart skipper is to use the rules to the full advantage.

A game is a competitive encounter, and to claim ignorance of the rules or that complain that the other side is smarter than you is for losers.

Sure, the rules committee needs to get smart and rewrite things for subsequent seasons, and what Carew did was sneaky sure - but I guess most of us, given the chance, would want our side to do the same.

Similarly remember the Brian Rose incident too - and equally thought he was correct (tho perhaps he might have had to refund entrance moneys..)


Ropemaker
Man City Transfer Target!

Sep 27, 2017, 12:06 PM

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Location: Surrey
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Post #14 of 17 (2865 views)
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Re: [broodleyhoo] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Following League meeting, Carew remain champions but have been relegated

They are appealing

http://www.bbc.co.uk/...-west-wales-41404646



Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.


broodleyhoo
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Sep 27, 2017, 1:40 PM

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Re: [Ropemaker] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Yes - I saw this.

In my view a terrible decision. Rules are rules and you play to them - and if a rule is found to be faulty, change it afterwards - but you can't go back in time and change what was the state of play at the start of the game.

A case in point is the RL rule that led to Whitehaven's golden point win over York recently


Tykeoldboy
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Sep 27, 2017, 2:12 PM

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Post #16 of 17 (2822 views)
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Following League meeting, Carew remain champions but have been relegated

They are appealing

http://www.bbc.co.uk/...-west-wales-41404646


Are they appealing against being crowned champions or being relegated?


Wheelbarrow
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May 15, 2018, 9:44 AM

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Re: [Tykeoldboy] Just not cricket [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Just bumping this thread from last year to mention that, as is the way of things, Cresselly have been drawn to host Carew in the Dyfed group of the National Village Cup! The game is down for Sunday 27th May.

Could be a spicy affair.

 
 


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