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Home: Non Football Related: General Chat:
My message to Mrs May

 



hawkwind
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Jun 7, 2017, 3:32 PM

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Post #1 of 59 (3086 views)
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My message to Mrs May Can't Post or Reply Privately

I have to vote on Thursday. Not that I should have to because of all the elections I have faced I cannot think of any that has been more unnecessary.

You declared that you needed this because the country is united but parliament isn't. I promise you that the country isn't united, and why should it be? The closest any country ever gets to being united is in wartime defending itself. Despite your language of 1939 the United Kingdom is not under that threat. As for parliament? You have heard of representative democracy perhaps? Calls from you that parliament should be united sound horribly similar to the nationalistic calls of Turkey's President Erdogan.

In any case I hadn't noticed you struggling in parliament. You managed to trigger Article 50 without difficulty thanks to an opposition party that rolled over on the floor and let you tickle their tummy. No the real reason that you called this election is political opportunism. Didn't you have something more important to do for the country?

There was a time, less than 14 months ago, when you were prepared to give the nation the benefits of well-reasoned advice. You might be surprised to know that I completely agreed with your conclusion of what was, and still is, in the United Kingdom's best interests. The question I ask myself today is why, as Prime Minister, have you not had the courage to stand up for what you supposedly believe in.

Let's be brutally clear. Completing the Brexit process will at best be an exercise in damage limitation, at worst will result in bringing misery to millions more in this country. A better Britain of milk and honey is an illusion, as you well know. Of course if everything was going to be wonderful after March 2019 you would 100% not have called an election now, but waited to reap the benefits of a landslide victory from an ecstatic grateful electorate in 2020.

During the last eleven and a half months I have searched for one concrete advantage that I could gain from the UK leaving the EU, one way in which my life would be better. I have asked friends, family and colleagues - I'm still waiting.

Passing our own laws? No-one can give me an example of an European law that could be replaced by a British law that was better for me. The value of a law is found in its contents not its author. Let's start with three examples where European law works for British citizens: (1) Mobile phone roaming charges which end throughout the EU on 15th June 2017, and begin again the day we leave the EU unless you accept otherwise which currently seems unlikely as you don't want to accept ECJ jurisdiction; (2) British Airways and the outsourcing IT to India debacle leading to a cancelled weekend for Heathrow. Compensation again EU law which covers all flights with a destination or departure airport within the EU. If the law disappears from this country BA would be obliged to continue paying compensation to EU citizens at the same level but would not have to pay British citizens; (3) Toxic air. Here we are in conflict with the EU because we haven't met our obligations. If we can keep stalling for another two years we will then be able legally to exceed current EU "safe limits" (not necessarily safe but at least less deadly than our current levels). And British businesses? Mergers and acquisitions above a certain size require approval not only by the European Commission but also by USA authorities. The recent acquisition of IPC by Rolls-Royce was approved subject to conditions by the EC. We either accept international law or our companies cease trading outside the UK? Blue Stilton Cheese or White for that matter or many other products that have protected status within the EU. One procedure, protection throughout 28 countries. How otherwise will we protect our products? And workers' rights? As the EU looks to improve and extend them over the next decade your plan is what?

Controlling our borders? "Now I know some people say the EU does not make us more secure because it does not allow us to control our border. But that is not true." Your words Mrs May. And you are right. Apart from our own little Schengen area with Ireland "we can conduct checks on people travelling to Britain from elsewhere in Europe. And, subject to certain rules and the availability of information, it means we can block entry for serious criminals and terrorists." Your words again. How many tens of thousands of people have we rejected at our borders this decade? First-hand I've been aware of a good dozen refused entry to the UK at Calais.

Your period as Prime Minister has been most noticeable for your meaningless soundbites such as "Brexit means Brexit", "Strong and stable", and now "Enough is enough". A Prime Minister needs to be someone that I can respect. Each PM begins with that then either keeps it or loses it.

In your case I no longer respect you for so many reasons. Here are just some:

Not asking the ECJ for a ruling on whether Article 50 is revokable (this you should have done on your first day in office);

The deal with Nissan. "Just generalities" we are told when asked what guarantees you gave, yet we are not allowed to see the letter because it is "commercially sensitive";

Walking hand-in-hand with Donald Trump - what were you thinking? You gave the impression you were too weak and wobbly to be able to walk independently;

Accusing the 48% of being anti-British. I share the views that you espoused in April 2016. A referendum result doesn't change the validity of my opinion, particularly as it is supported by the facts;

Being friendly towards Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Turkey and the Philippines amongst others yet cold towards Europe;

Repeatedly telling the country that you would not call a snap General Election then u-turning and calling an early election;

Refusing to participate in the ITV leaders' debate and the BBC election debate;

Refusing to accept that UK foreign policy has worsened the refugee crisis (is it true that the UK has spent 13 more times sterling bombing Libya than helping it rebuild?);

Not expressing a public opinion on Trump's withdrawal from the Paris agreement. Doesn't the UK have an opinion on climate change? If you want an example of how independent and sovereign leaders should react check out Angela Merkel and Emmanuel Macron;

Refusing to condemn Trump for his totally unwarranted attacks on London Mayor Sadiq Khan. If you want an example of how a British Prime Minister should respond to an American President then listen to Hugh Grant's speech in Love Actually;

Offering Trump a full state visit and refusing to rescind it. Yes, you have to deal with him and that involves face-to-face meetings. Regardless of our military strengths any UK PM should meet Trump on equal terms not on their hands and knees;

Failing to publish the report into terrorist funding;

Trying to squeeze electoral advantage out of the recent terrorist attacks. If there is one issue that the country deserves a united response from politicians it is the fight against terror. No-one is suggesting that a risk zero of terror attacks exists, and everyone praises the response of our police forces and hospitals and other public services however you're right "enough is enough". Whilst the other parties have been in opposition you have been Home Secretary and Prime Minister. Your cuts no-one elses. They need to be reversed. You should be embarrassed and ashamed;

Failing to answer questions. Evade, evade, evade.

There are many other examples but I would like to turn again to Brexit and the most irresponsible soundbite you have uttered as PM.

Your "no deal is better than a bad deal". Every British citizen who currently lives in the EU has every reason to disagree with you. Every British citizen who has at some time worked in the EU building up pension rights has every reason to disagree with you. Every British citizen who remembers the terrible times before the Good Friday agreement has every reason to disagree with you. Every British citizen who values living in a modern western European democracy has every reason to disagree with you.

You talk about building a better Britain for every one of us (yet support the continuation of zero-hours contracts). This is 2017. You cannot turn the clock back. There is no British Empire to drain resources from. Isolationism can no longer work. Churchill, De Gaulle and Eisenhower understood after World War Two that values are international. That's why they supported a Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Technology has given us the Internet which opens information access and communication paths to everyone. The EU has made it easier to exchange on every level. Prosperity, yours, mine, ours, is dependent on working together.

You claim that the EU wants to "punish us". More claptrap and simple to disprove. The EU are demanding open and transparent negotiations, you Mrs May want negotiations to be carried out in secret. Every British citizen should find that disturbing. It is essential that these negotiations are open and transparent, that no-one has any place to hide, that every British citizen can judge for themselves the reality.

I could carry on writing for a while but I guess you understand my position. You asked me to judge you on your record. I believe that you let the country down when you were Home Secretary, you have caused damage in your short stint as Prime Minister, and that maintaining you in office would be disastrous for the UK, my country.

You have to go.


007Dale
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Jun 7, 2017, 4:55 PM

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Post #2 of 59 (3038 views)
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Re: [hawkwind] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Just checking, you're voting Tory then?


jrev61
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Jun 7, 2017, 5:08 PM

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Re: [007Dale] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Well written Hawkwind, agree with almost everything you say.
The woman is a cowardly, gutless, two-faced liar.
Unfortunately she will still be elected tomorrow. I'm rapidly losing faith in democracy, although as we shall see there will be little that is democratic in the way she run(or destroys) the country.



jrev61


leohoenig
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Jun 7, 2017, 5:43 PM

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Post #4 of 59 (3007 views)
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Re: [jrev61] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

For democracy to work, the electorate needs to have adequate and accurate information on what they are voting on.
This requires a free and honest press - which this country does not have.
Most of the press is biased in favour of one party, as they believe it supports their proprietors narrow business interests
A portion, (rather smaller) is clearly biased the other way.

Having said that, I suspect most of the public would not be interested in reality, if it was presented to them
Nationalistic, Xenophobic lies are far more appealling.
Always better that whatever problems we face are someone else's fault

So, for the moment - it is all down to the EU forcing laws and taxes on us.
Next, it is doing what is necessary to face down the evil terrorists, (even if that means adopting policies that create more terrorists).
And don't worry, we'll find a new bogeyman when we need one.



Fat AND Pompous.
The proof that you can have too much of a good thing
Now blogging at http://www.leohoenig.com



splodge
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Jun 7, 2017, 7:57 PM

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Post #5 of 59 (2944 views)
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Re: [leohoenig] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

My message to Mrs May is just 2 words long but Hawkwind is spot on..

The 2nd being off. I'll let you guess the first whilst I make a cuppa.



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acmold
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Jun 7, 2017, 8:21 PM

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Post #6 of 59 (2928 views)
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Re: [splodge] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or


In Reply To
My message to Mrs May is just 2 words long but Hawkwind is spot on..

The 2nd being off. I'll let you guess the first whilst I make a cuppa.


I must admit life is to short to read it all, but what I did read I agreed with. The 900 leather trousers got me, life will be so good then with her we will all have wardrobes of posh clubber instead of Primark and Peacock stuff. Many of use are getting on a bit, some of use have a few bob in the bank but since they got in interest rates have got so low if you have an investment income it has been slashed. She's going to get rid of the triple lock pension. If you get dementia they will leave you with 100k but take your house. They are going to means test your heating allowance. No doubt they will do away with the bus pass. So why would anyone over 50 / 55 even think about voting Tory. And as I always say at this point get a pension check on their new superdupa state pension, you now have to have 35 years in but opted out years don't count so most people don't qualify for a full pension.

Their mates will be untouched and still hide their money offshore to avoid tax.

This time round they are all useless but most people will be far worst off if the Tories get In. And they will continue the austerity and the NHS won't get better and council services and police numbers will be slashed. And immigration won't change as most Tories want / need cheap Eastern European labour to keep their profits up.


garethwrexy
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Jun 7, 2017, 8:38 PM

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Post #7 of 59 (2918 views)
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Re: [007Dale] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Me too



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UKPunk
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Jun 7, 2017, 9:40 PM

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Post #8 of 59 (2884 views)
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Re: [leohoenig] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
For democracy to work, the electorate needs to have adequate and accurate information on what they are voting on.
This requires a free and honest press - which this country does not have.
Most of the press is biased in favour of one party, as they believe it supports their proprietors narrow business interests
A portion, (rather smaller) is clearly biased the other way.

Having said that, I suspect most of the public would not be interested in reality, if it was presented to them
Nationalistic, Xenophobic lies are far more appealling.
Always better that whatever problems we face are someone else's fault

So, for the moment - it is all down to the EU forcing laws and taxes on us.
Next, it is doing what is necessary to face down the evil terrorists, (even if that means adopting policies that create more terrorists).
And don't worry, we'll find a new bogeyman when we need one.

We really do need to get away from this idea that political journalism is or has ever been about honesty and/or integrity. The purpose of newspapers has never been to report the truth. It's always been about convincing the reader that the views expressed in the publication are true when in fact they are merely a vehicle for the views of the owners of said publication.

I always find myself disappointed, but not surprised that so many people still believe what they read in the papers. I myself stopped reading them years ago. In my view a political journalist is no more believable than the lowest sort of con artist.



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steve walker
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Jun 7, 2017, 9:40 PM

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Post #9 of 59 (2884 views)
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Re: [acmold] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

So how is it that polls, no matter which one you go with are predicting a Conservative majority? I must admit I don't get it either.

The electorate aren't really stupid and those that are won't bother voting at all so how is it that ppl are looking at the two alternatives and are still intending to vote Tory? I must admit that I don't understand it. I just don't get it but I have to put that down to a failing on my part. Life is shit for so many ppl and it really doesn't have to be like this.


Ronsdog
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Jun 7, 2017, 10:57 PM

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Post #10 of 59 (2833 views)
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Re: [leohoenig] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
For democracy to work, the electorate needs to have adequate and accurate information on what they are voting on.
This requires a free and honest press - which this country does not have.
Most of the press is biased in favour of one party, as they believe it supports their proprietors narrow business interests
A portion, (rather smaller) is clearly biased the other way.

Having said that, I suspect most of the public would not be interested in reality, if it was presented to them
Nationalistic, Xenophobic lies are far more appealling.
Always better that whatever problems we face are someone else's fault

So, for the moment - it is all down to the EU forcing laws and taxes on us.
Next, it is doing what is necessary to face down the evil terrorists, (even if that means adopting policies that create more terrorists).
And don't worry, we'll find a new bogeyman when we need one.


For democracy to work, first and foremost, you need choice.
The electorate now have a real choice.

This is the first Left v Right contest this century.
All others have seen both major parties wooing the electorate from the middle ground.

Neither Corbyn or May would be my Prime Minister but that's the choice folks....

Maybe this bloke has all the answers

https://inews.co.uk/...lect-candidate-says/ Cool


HantsLondoner
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Jun 7, 2017, 11:09 PM

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Re: [steve walker] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Nice one, Hawkwind. Agree with all you've said. I may borrow it, if that's OK?

Unfortunately, a lot of the electorate will vote for the same party, regardless of how bad their leader or their policies have become.

That's why I think the Tories will win tomorrow, the only question is whether they will get an overall majority.

I think Labour are coming up fast, unfortunately they started far too late. If the election had been in December they might have had a chance. The most encouraging thing for them is that they are getting younger people interested. Shame we may have another five years of Tory rule, and their version of Brexit, to endure.

In my opinion Labour have provided little opposition until a few weeks ago, when they released their manifesto, which I thought had a lot of good things in it.
But they let the Tories do what they wanted on Article 50, and generally I feel they've not provided the check and balance on governmental policy that it was their duty to provide, as the main opposing party.



If you're going to/been to a Hampshire Premier League match, I'd really appreciate you filling in a questionnaire - available in the Groundhopping/General section, or just PM me for a copy. Thanks.

(This post was edited by HantsLondoner on Jun 7, 2017, 11:21 PM)


PaulC
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Jun 7, 2017, 11:10 PM

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Post #12 of 59 (2824 views)
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Re: [steve walker] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
So how is it that polls, no matter which one you go with are predicting a Conservative majority? I must admit I don't get it either.

The electorate aren't really stupid


I wish I were quite as sanguine.

Far too many swallow the lies and propaganda of the right wing billionaire-owned press.


Mike S
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Jun 8, 2017, 7:16 AM

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Re: [PaulC] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Elections are in the end about the economy. That's why Trump won, he realised this although will probably not help the US one
The majority believe they will be financially better off under the Tories
Brexit, dementia tax, even the NHS are secondary to this
Therefore the Tories will win as that is how things are perceived
Personally I think this is one of the most important elections for years and am now off to vote for what I hope will be for the new government but I some how doubt it. The best hope is a hung parliament but even a much reduced tory majority will get rid of May and that will I suppose be a result. There are however a whole line of similar ones in the wings to maintain the status quo


Turbine View
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Jun 8, 2017, 8:31 AM

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Re: [Mike S] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

We just need enough 18-25's to vote, but will they?



Have no Plan A and apply it rigidly..


acmold
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Jun 8, 2017, 8:44 AM

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Re: [Turbine View] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or


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We just need enough 18-25's to vote, but will they?


They seem very active around here and will vote Labour or Lib Dem, but I expect Labour will get back in anyway which will not change the overall picture.

I voted at 7.15am quite a few people already voting.

As MikeS says a hang parliament or a very narrow Tory majority may be the best thing. I think Mrs May has probably had her chips. Not only over this election campaign but what is coming out from when she was home secretary.

All parties need to rid themselves of the likes of Diane Abbott and Boris Johnson to be taken more seriously. All candidates for all parties should be made to declare their other interests to the most minute degree and publish their income and tax affairs. Anyone found avoiding tax by putting money offshore or having had problems with the HMRC or hiding money in family members names over and above the legal limits should be barred from standing as an MP.


PaulC
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Jun 8, 2017, 8:55 AM

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Re: [Mike S] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
The majority believe they will be financially better off under the Tories


I'd love to hear their reasoning.


leohoenig
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Jun 8, 2017, 9:26 AM

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Post #17 of 59 (2704 views)
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Re: [PaulC] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
The majority believe they will be financially better off under the Tories


I'd love to hear their reasoning.


Simples - it says so in the Daily Mail

I would say I am fairly well off, depite not having much actual cash in the banks. Despite this, it appears that the Conservatives have more plans to increase my taxation than the Labour party.

The only point where I see a difference favouring the tories is if I (or my wife) do not have to go into care before we die, and hence have kept most of our property based equity. Labour propose lower inheritance tax thresholds than the Conservatives.

I have cast my vote in favour of the party that appears to be the better for my short term finances. It is not Conservative



Fat AND Pompous.
The proof that you can have too much of a good thing
Now blogging at http://www.leohoenig.com



kirby knitters
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Jun 8, 2017, 9:39 AM

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Re: [leohoenig] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

My message to Mrs May..


I have just voted Conservative.


pitch 63
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Jun 8, 2017, 10:04 AM

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Re: [kirby knitters] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

May is finished; it is now June


Turbine View
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Jun 8, 2017, 11:09 AM

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Post #20 of 59 (2641 views)
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Re: [kirby knitters] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

My message to Mrs. M. I didn't..



Have no Plan A and apply it rigidly..


Fanatic
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Jun 8, 2017, 12:12 PM

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Re: [HantsLondoner] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
I think Labour are coming up fast, unfortunately they started far too late. If the election had been in December they might have had a chance. The most encouraging thing for them is that they are getting younger people interested. Shame we may have another five years of Tory rule, and their version of Brexit, to endure.


Ultimately I fear that it is the Labour MPs that refused to back Corbyn when he was elected that will cost the party this election.

If they had got behind him from day one and devoted their time to rebutting the attacks against him instead of adding to them, then I think fewer people would have been swayed by the whole terrorist sympathiser nonsense. He would also have a much better front bench.


Ronsdog
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Jun 8, 2017, 2:26 PM

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Re: [Fanatic] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

 
The electorate recognise that Labour is a split party and rarely, if ever, do a party with such divisions get elected.

It beggars belief that the party elected Mr Corbyn , a serial rebel, as their leader.

He ' lost the dressing room before a ball was kicked '.

A new leader with a different agenda may save the party from a generation out of power.


(This post was edited by Ronsdog on Jun 8, 2017, 2:31 PM)


Isaac
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Jun 8, 2017, 3:10 PM

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Post #23 of 59 (2533 views)
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Re: [Turbine View] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
My message to Mrs. M. I didn't..


Me neither, I couldn't vote for her or CorbynMad!


Steveb
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Jun 8, 2017, 3:29 PM

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Re: [Fanatic] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
I think Labour are coming up fast, unfortunately they started far too late. If the election had been in December they might have had a chance. The most encouraging thing for them is that they are getting younger people interested. Shame we may have another five years of Tory rule, and their version of Brexit, to endure.


Ultimately I fear that it is the Labour MPs that refused to back Corbyn when he was elected that will cost the party this election.

If they had got behind him from day one and devoted their time to rebutting the attacks against him instead of adding to them, then I think fewer people would have been swayed by the whole terrorist sympathiser nonsense. He would also have a much better front bench.


Agreed ... although had that been the case the Labour Party would've been in a stronger position and so May wouldn't have risked an election.




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mick
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Jun 8, 2017, 4:08 PM

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Re: [Isaac] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
My message to Mrs. M. I didn't..


Me neither, I couldn't vote for her or CorbynMad!


Of course you couldn't. Neither are standing for election in Kent

I saw the headline on the Express this morning- "Vote for May Today". You can imagine confused readers who don't live in the Maidenhead area searching in vain for May on their ballot paper.

Meanwhile, the residents of Maidenhead will be out in their thousands voting for a serial liar to represent them.


Isaac
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Jun 8, 2017, 4:18 PM

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Post #26 of 59 (1231 views)
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Re: [mick] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
My message to Mrs. M. I didn't..


Me neither, I couldn't vote for her or CorbynMad!


Of course you couldn't. Neither are standing for election in Kent

I saw the headline on the Express this morning- "Vote for May Today". You can imagine confused readers who don't live in the Maidenhead area searching in vain for May on their ballot paper.

Meanwhile, the residents of Maidenhead will be out in their thousands voting for a serial liar to represent them.


You know what I meantCrazy!


Turbine View
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Jun 8, 2017, 4:38 PM

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Re: [mick] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Indeed, incidently Isaac, for the record I didn't vote for Corbyn, but for an outstanding local Labour candidate in Stroud, David Drew, a local legend in these parts, nobody works harder for local people.



Have no Plan A and apply it rigidly..

(This post was edited by Turbine View on Jun 8, 2017, 4:39 PM)


mick
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Jun 8, 2017, 5:03 PM

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Re: [Isaac] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
You know what I meantCrazy!


I am not a mind reader and can only go on what you said. If you meant something different to what you said then it would be better to actually say what you did mean, rather than claiming 1 "know" when I can only guess.


PaulC
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Jun 8, 2017, 5:08 PM

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Post #29 of 59 (1198 views)
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Re: [Ronsdog] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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The electorate recognise that Labour is a split party and rarely, if ever, do a party with such divisions get elected.

It beggars belief that the party elected Mr Corbyn , a serial rebel, as their leader.

He ' lost the dressing room before a ball was kicked '.

A new leader with a different agenda may save the party from a generation out of power.


Assuming the Tories win, I think the likely outcome is that they will preside over 5 years of chaos (no need for a coalition) as they take us out of the EU and continue with their austerity programme.

Impressive as Corbyn's campaign has been, he needs to realise that the Tory media will ensure that he will be well night unelectable, by constantly dredging up the past and villifying him. Sadly there's an element in the electorate which would rather dwell on what he did or did not do 35 years ago than think about the next 5 years and the damage the Tories will do to them.

His policies have resonated with the electorate. The opportunity is now there to keep the Tories out of office for at least a decade at the next election if Labour sticks to Corbyn's policies and elects a leader the Tory media will find harder to denigrate.

Sir Keir Starmer would be my choice.

Labour in Scotland is a different kettle of fish. They will get nowhere until they align themselves with the progressive policies of the SNP rather than sharing an anti-independence bed with the Tories and neglecting the true purpose of the Labour Party. They are a shambles.


PaulC
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Jun 8, 2017, 5:24 PM

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Re: [PaulC] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

The Times message to Theresa May:




PaulC
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Jun 8, 2017, 5:28 PM

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Post #31 of 59 (1183 views)
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Re: [leohoenig] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
The majority believe they will be financially better off under the Tories


I'd love to hear their reasoning.


Simples - it says so in the Daily Mail


Sun: Murdoch, $12.2bn, Tory
Mail: Rothermere, $1.22bn, Tory
Express: Desmond, $1.42bn, Tory

And they wonder why so many C2DEs vote Tory.


Isaac
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Jun 8, 2017, 5:57 PM

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Post #32 of 59 (1174 views)
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Re: [mick] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
You know what I meantCrazy!


I am not a mind reader and can only go on what you said. If you meant something different to what you said then it would be better to actually say what you did mean, rather than claiming 1 "know" when I can only guess.


Pendant alertCool!


Richard Rundle
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Jun 8, 2017, 6:04 PM

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Post #33 of 59 (1167 views)
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Re: [PaulC] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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Impressive as Corbyn's campaign has been...


Really? I think he's been as impressive as a stick of wet celery. Same with Farron. And May hasn't really campaigned at all, relying on TV soundbites from closed meetings.


Isaac
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Jun 8, 2017, 6:17 PM

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Re: [Richard Rundle] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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In Reply To
Impressive as Corbyn's campaign has been...


Really? I think he's been as impressive as a stick of wet celery. Same with Farron. And May hasn't really campaigned at all, relying on TV soundbites from closed meetings.


I wouldn't disagree at all, probably the most dull insipid election campaign ever?


mick
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Jun 8, 2017, 6:31 PM

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Re: [Isaac] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
You know what I meantCrazy!


I am not a mind reader and can only go on what you said. If you meant something different to what you said then it would be better to actually say what you did mean, rather than claiming I "know" when I can only guess.


Pendant alertCool!


What has a piece of jewellery got do do with anything Shocked

Are all your posts now going to be riddles ?


Isaac
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Jun 8, 2017, 6:41 PM

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Re: [mick] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
You know what I meantCrazy!


I am not a mind reader and can only go on what you said. If you meant something different to what you said then it would be better to actually say what you did mean, rather than claiming I "know" when I can only guess.


Pendant alertCool!


What has a piece of jewellery got do do with anything Shocked

Are all your posts now going to be riddles ?


Pedant even
Angelic


Ronsdog
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Jun 8, 2017, 9:27 PM

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Post #37 of 59 (1069 views)
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Re: [PaulC] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
The electorate recognise that Labour is a split party and rarely, if ever, do a party with such divisions get elected.

It beggars belief that the party elected Mr Corbyn , a serial rebel, as their leader.

He ' lost the dressing room before a ball was kicked '.

A new leader with a different agenda may save the party from a generation out of power.




Impressive as Corbyn's campaign has been, he needs to realise that the Tory media will ensure that he will be well night unelectable, by constantly dredging up the past and villifying him. Sadly there's an element in the electorate which would rather dwell on what he did or did not do 35 years ago than think about the next 5 years and the damage the Tories will do to them.

His policies have resonated with the electorate. The opportunity is now there to keep the Tories out of office for at least a decade at the next election if Labour sticks to Corbyn's policies and elects a leader the Tory media will find harder to denigrate.

Sir Keir Starmer would be my choice.

Labour in Scotland is a different kettle of fish. They will get nowhere until they align themselves with the progressive policies of the SNP rather than sharing an anti-independence bed with the Tories and neglecting the true purpose of the Labour Party. They are a shambles.


Keir Starmer seems to have all the qualities that would be necessary to heal the self inflicted wounds within the party. He would also command respect from an otherwise hostile press.

However, that is dependant on Corbyn not reaching the magic 200 seats figure or as George Osborne, no friend of the Labour Party or Mrs May come to that, put it in today's Standard.....

........The Labour leader is on a mission to secure the future of Labourfor the hard left. He looks certain to get more than the 29% of the vote Gordon Brown got in 2010 or the 30% Ed Miliband got in 2015. If he gets more than the 35% that Tony Blair got in 2005 he will claim that he's got the best Labour result in 16 years......

I'm pretty sure that the Tories will have a clear majority of around 50.
My interest this evening will be on the magic % of the vote/number of seats, that Mr Corbyns leadership returns.

The future direction of the Labour Party hinges on those two factors.


PaulC
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Jun 8, 2017, 10:20 PM

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Post #38 of 59 (1032 views)
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Re: [Ronsdog] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Message to Mrs May:

Your P45 awaits.


jon b
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Jun 9, 2017, 4:25 AM

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Re: [PaulC] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

On the plus side you're going to have plenty of time available for shopping for leopard shoes and leather trousers. Tongue


acmold
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Jun 9, 2017, 8:23 AM

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Re: [jon b] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or


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On the plus side you're going to have plenty of time available for shopping for leopard shoes and leather trousers. Tongue


Or running naked through a Wheat field, probably near Maidenhead but so much better if she went back to her roots and did it in Wheatley.


kirby knitters
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Jun 9, 2017, 9:40 AM

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Post #41 of 59 (914 views)
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Re: [acmold] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

My immediate reaction on watching these horrors unfolding throughout the night was the sooner she is gone the better simply because the whole mess is down to her and her alone but on reflection maybe its for the best for her to hang around for a while and try and sort this shambles out but I have very little confidence she is now in a position to do so. another election is surely around the corner and I for one will not be bothering with it for the first time.


Isaac
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Jun 9, 2017, 11:12 AM

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Post #42 of 59 (883 views)
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Re: [kirby knitters] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
My immediate reaction on watching these horrors unfolding throughout the night was the sooner she is gone the better simply because the whole mess is down to her and her alone but on reflection maybe its for the best for her to hang around for a while and try and sort this shambles out but I have very little confidence she is now in a position to do so. another election is surely around the corner and I for one will not be bothering with it for the first time.


I think she should resign today, she took a gamble and it failed big time. Was it was arrogance or was the thinking that she could get former UKIP voters who were at a loose end on her side? And surely if the Labour party had a half decent leader they would have taken the spoils?

I can see another election within the year with the Conservatives, probably under Boris, getting a far bigger majority having had the proverbial shot across the bows.


jrev61
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Jun 9, 2017, 11:17 AM

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Re: [Isaac] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I get the impression that many in the Conservative Party can't stand Boris. If he was that popular Theresa May would have been told to resign. She seems to be the lesser of two evils for many Tory MP's.



jrev61


UKPunk
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Jun 9, 2017, 1:48 PM

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Re: [jrev61] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

My message to Theresa May... Laugh Laugh Laugh

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9QEAtcz3o8



1-0-1-0-4-25-40-65-181-289=606

Last game: Mon 20/8/18
4. Basford United 1 Hednesford Town 2


PaulC
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Jun 9, 2017, 1:53 PM

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Re: [jrev61] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
I get the impression that many in the Conservative Party can't stand Boris. If he was that popular Theresa May would have been told to resign. She seems to be the lesser of two evils for many Tory MP's.


May has been nailed to the mast.

She'll soon be on her way.


Bradshaw
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Jun 9, 2017, 3:12 PM

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Re: [PaulC] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

The arrogance of the Tories has been their undoing. The public rightly saw that this election was called in an attempt to steamroller the opposition into oblivion. Well the British don't care too much for a smug varmint and they don't like to see the underdog kicked when he's down. "Judge us on our record" said Amber Rudd. Well we did my girl, we did!!!!


PaulC
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Jun 9, 2017, 3:25 PM

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Post #47 of 59 (758 views)
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Re: [Bradshaw] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
The arrogance of the Tories has been their undoing. The public rightly saw that this election was called in an attempt to steamroller the opposition into oblivion. Well the British don't care too much for a smug varmint and they don't like to see the underdog kicked when he's down. "Judge us on our record" said Amber Rudd. Well we did my girl, we did!!!!


Amber Rudd majority 350

Dianne Abbott majority 35,000


Turbine View
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Jun 9, 2017, 4:40 PM

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Re: [PaulC] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

The huge plus for me on the night which completely negated the tory press because none of these guys reads it was the fantastic 72% turnout by 18-25 year olds lots of celebratory groups shown on tv sheer joy and excitement evident that they had taken part in sopmething really ground breaking. Long may this continue. Its so overdue and at last its nice to see the young enthused by politics. Corbyn is entitled to claim credit for that.



Have no Plan A and apply it rigidly..


PaulC
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Jun 9, 2017, 7:25 PM

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Post #49 of 59 (650 views)
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Re: [Turbine View] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
The huge plus for me on the night which completely negated the tory press because none of these guys reads it was the fantastic 72% turnout by 18-25 year olds lots of celebratory groups shown on tv sheer joy and excitement evident that they had taken part in sopmething really ground breaking. Long may this continue. Its so overdue and at last its nice to see the young enthused by politics. Corbyn is entitled to claim credit for that.


Yes indeed.


Fanatic
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Jun 9, 2017, 7:50 PM

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Post #50 of 59 (636 views)
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Re: [Turbine View] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
The huge plus for me on the night which completely negated the tory press because none of these guys reads it was the fantastic 72% turnout by 18-25 year olds lots of celebratory groups shown on tv sheer joy and excitement evident that they had taken part in sopmething really ground breaking. Long may this continue. Its so overdue and at last its nice to see the young enthused by politics. Corbyn is entitled to claim credit for that.


Also, the Canterbury result will have shown students what their voting power is. Shock result of the night?


jrev61
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Jun 10, 2017, 9:36 AM

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Post #51 of 59 (1239 views)
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Re: [Fanatic] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
The huge plus for me on the night which completely negated the tory press because none of these guys reads it was the fantastic 72% turnout by 18-25 year olds lots of celebratory groups shown on tv sheer joy and excitement evident that they had taken part in sopmething really ground breaking. Long may this continue. Its so overdue and at last its nice to see the young enthused by politics. Corbyn is entitled to claim credit for that.


Also, the Canterbury result will have shown students what their voting power is. Shock result of the night?


The Tories win in Moray was also a huge shock. This will save the taxpayer a lot of money as Angus Robertson claimed 60,000 in expenses last year.
Vince Cables huge win in Twickenham was also a bit of a surprise as he's an old fogey who sold off Royal Mail at way below it's real value when in the coalition government. A pity that next door in Richmond park a much better Lib Dem candidate lost to the obnoxious Zack Goldsmith.



jrev61


Towlawtom
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Jun 10, 2017, 9:54 AM

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Re: [jrev61] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Is the new government going to be known as the Conservative Unionist Negotiating Team? An appropriate acronym thereLaugh



I need to have the last word, as it always looks as if I am right !


PaulC
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Jun 10, 2017, 9:54 AM

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Post #53 of 59 (1235 views)
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Re: [jrev61] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
The Tories win in Moray was also a huge shock. This will save the taxpayer a lot of money as Angus Robertson claimed 60,000 in expenses last year.

A quick check of the figures shows Scotland's sole Tory MP, living a few hundred miles closer to London than Robertson, claimed just under 200,000 in expenses in 2015-16.


(This post was edited by PaulC on Jun 10, 2017, 9:57 AM)


jrev61
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Jun 10, 2017, 12:06 PM

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Post #54 of 59 (1177 views)
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Re: [PaulC] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
The Tories win in Moray was also a huge shock. This will save the taxpayer a lot of money as Angus Robertson claimed 60,000 in expenses last year.

A quick check of the figures shows Scotland's sole Tory MP, living a few hundred miles closer to London than Robertson, claimed just under 200,000 in expenses in 2015-16.

t

Blimey did he hire a chauffeur and a stretch limo to drive him to Westminster? There should be a cap on expenses based on where the MP lives.



jrev61


Fanatic
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Jun 10, 2017, 12:22 PM

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Post #55 of 59 (1169 views)
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Re: [jrev61] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
The Tories win in Moray was also a huge shock. This will save the taxpayer a lot of money as Angus Robertson claimed 60,000 in expenses last year.

A quick check of the figures shows Scotland's sole Tory MP, living a few hundred miles closer to London than Robertson, claimed just under 200,000 in expenses in 2015-16.

t

Blimey did he hire a chauffeur and a stretch limo to drive him to Westminster? There should be a cap on expenses based on where the MP lives.


From what I understand, the Moray result was expected. Alex Salmond losing was more of a surprise.

Also, Robertson actually claimed 39k last year (I've just checked on the IPSA website). 10k was for travel and 15k was for accomodation, which seems a reasonable for an MP having to live part time in London and frequently return to northern Scotland. The MP in the neighbouring constituency (Inverness) claimed 64k.

To be fair to the MP Paul has highlighted, it appears the rule changed in 2016 and MPs no longer claim staffing costs through their expenses (138k of the 200k in 2015/16 was for staffing).

Personally I think it would be worth the government buying or building a 600-room hotel in London and allowing MPs to live in that, rather than go through the expenses route, which allows for various corruption possibilities. Same for constituency offices, which can be rented from local parties/patrons at exorbitant rents.


paulh66
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Jun 10, 2017, 12:56 PM

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Re: [Fanatic] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

It shouldn't be beyond the leaders of our nation to implement an effective expenses procedure with enough checks and balances to prevent corruption. Most companies have one. Expecting MPs to live alongside each other when in London isn't really reasonable and, as I'm sure anyone who works away from home would agree, the idea of having to spend one's own time cooped up in the same building as work colleagues for any significant length of time is too stifling and very unappealing. Even more so when half of those colleagues are people you've spent most of your working day opposing!


MrTangerineMan
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Jun 10, 2017, 4:08 PM

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Post #57 of 59 (1090 views)
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Re: [Fanatic] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
The Tories win in Moray was also a huge shock. This will save the taxpayer a lot of money as Angus Robertson claimed 60,000 in expenses last year.

A quick check of the figures shows Scotland's sole Tory MP, living a few hundred miles closer to London than Robertson, claimed just under 200,000 in expenses in 2015-16.

t

Blimey did he hire a chauffeur and a stretch limo to drive him to Westminster? There should be a cap on expenses based on where the MP lives.


From what I understand, the Moray result was expected. Alex Salmond losing was more of a surprise.

Also, Robertson actually claimed 39k last year (I've just checked on the IPSA website). 10k was for travel and 15k was for accomodation, which seems a reasonable for an MP having to live part time in London and frequently return to northern Scotland. The MP in the neighbouring constituency (Inverness) claimed 64k.

To be fair to the MP Paul has highlighted, it appears the rule changed in 2016 and MPs no longer claim staffing costs through their expenses (138k of the 200k in 2015/16 was for staffing).

Personally I think it would be worth the government buying or building a 600-room hotel in London and allowing MPs to live in that, rather than go through the expenses route, which allows for various corruption possibilities. Same for constituency offices, which can be rented from local parties/patrons at exorbitant rents.


I said the same years ago, re: a designated hotel, but weirdly enough the biggest opponents of this were on the left.

Would make sense and would weed out those MP's just in it for the money.


MrTangerineMan
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Jun 10, 2017, 7:07 PM

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Post #58 of 59 (1058 views)
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Re: [MrTangerineMan] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

My message to not just Mrs. May but also to the other party leaders as well:

As a resident of Blackpool, how will you help the people mentioned in this article and improve their lives for the better?

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/12/when-lights-go-out

Or are they not worth caring about?


Fanatic
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Jun 10, 2017, 9:59 PM

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Post #59 of 59 (1006 views)
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Re: [MrTangerineMan] My message to Mrs May [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
My message to not just Mrs. May but also to the other party leaders as well:

As a resident of Blackpool, how will you help the people mentioned in this article and improve their lives for the better?

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/12/when-lights-go-out

Or are they not worth caring about?


A very interesting article, especially the focus on housing. I think it's fair to say the government's housing policies are amongst their worst. We need serious investment in building new social housing and an immediate end to right to buy so that it makes it worth investing in refurbishment of housing (the current situation means the council can spend thousands of pounds refurbishing houses/flats with a view to recouping the cost via rent, only to lose the property at well below market value). The government's plans to extend right to buy to non-council social housing is bonkers as it involves forcing councils to pay the discounts (up to 100k per property) so the landlords don't lose out. This was proposed to be funded by selling off empty social housing rather than letting it to new tenants Unsure

Another big thing the government has messed up is insulation programmes. It's an extremely effective measure because it has so many positive outcomes - warmer housing saves the NHS money as people with respiratory conditions are less likely to become ill and need hospital treatment (a case study in Oldham saw a huge drop in A&E admissions after an estate insulation programme), as well as increasing things like educational attainment and reducing problems like damp/condensation/mould, which both keeps the property in a better condition, and is another positive health benefit. And of course it means lower fuel bills, meaning tenants have more money to spend, which is likely to be in the local economy. On top of this, there is the regeneration aspect, which has a positive impact on the area.

A few years ago there were some good government schemes and many councils insulated pretty much all cavity wall properties. However, this left the solid walled properties (insulating which costs about 20 times the cost of cavity wall). There was a special funding programme for this. However, under pressure from the energy companies, the government diluted it, which hugely reduced the amount of money available to the extent that in some cases it costs as much to apply for it as you get back.

The list of other problems the government has created for housing is almost endless - dropping the commitment to zero carbon homes (which would have meant new housing being built to higher energy efficiency standards), getting rid of lifetime tenancies, the refusal to pass a law requiring rented property to be fit for human habitation, allowing offices to be converted to housing without planning permission (which also badly affects small businesses) etc etc.


My concern is that we are increasingly living in a rentier economy where those at the top have been able to use their existing capital to buy assets like housing and business premises and then sit back and live off the income. It ends up being a cycle whereby they are able to afford to buy more property as they can outcompete renters who are unable to save up to buy; one of the local shops near me has just had its rent doubled by the landlord who owns dozens of similar properties. It's the same for public services - privatisation is a way of ensuring a guaranteed income stream for those at the top by passing vast amounts of public money to private companies.

This I suspect is why they are so absolutely terrified of someone like Corbyn. Rent controls, social housing and unprivatisation means their income stream drying up.

 
 


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